Bird Wren problems

#1
So over in my restoration thread im finally fixing up a mini bike I got back in 2001-02ish well im like 80% done but Ive run into some fitment issues. I think most of these stem from the tire/rim size being to big.
1. the gas tank is really really close to the back tire making it so i have to position the engine in the fwd most spot.
2. The scrub brake pad in its stock form does not fit at all without much cutting. Again tires to big
3. I like the look of the bigger tires so im torn on whether I should do a PZ19 carb conversion with the addition of a remote tank also Id have to loose the 80 tooth sprocket
4. And this is purely cosmetic, Wife knocked over the bike in the garage and some how didn't realize she did it, all the gas spilled out ruining the paint on the tank and chipping the paint on the frame in several locations. Although rest assured it was ultimately my fault for putting it in a place it would get knocked over..... some of you may be able to relate.

Im sure some of you all have had these problems I am so grateful for you all thus far your wisdom and insight has been Paramount for me. IMG_3006.jpg IMG_3007.jpg IMG_3008.jpg IMG_3009.jpg IMG_3010.jpg IMG_3012.jpg IMG_3013.jpg IMG_3014.jpg IMG_3015.jpg
 
#2
Now I better understand some of the issues. Thanks for posting the pics. Starting with the paint. Use High Temp engine paint on your gas tank. Most are resistant to gas and oil. Robertsons Torque Tubes may have a nice header for you, that will move the exhaust away from the carb and tank. You might try a couple of springs, on your brake pad. One to keep the top pulled back away from the tire, when at rest and another to pull the whole mounting bracket back as far as it will go, when at rest. That looks like the bigger 5hp tank, (3qt). The smaller 3hp tanks, (1 and 2 qt), are still available from Briggs. That would aid in your tire clearance without the hassle of the new carb and tank. You could gain anywhere from about 3/4 of an inch to 1 1/2 inch of clearance. But, you will have to put the matching smaller pickup tube on your carb.
 
#3
Now I better understand some of the issues. Thanks for posting the pics. Starting with the paint. Use High Temp engine paint on your gas tank. Most are resistant to gas and oil. Robertsons Torque Tubes may have a nice header for you, that will move the exhaust away from the carb and tank. You might try a couple of springs, on your brake pad. One to keep the top pulled back away from the tire, when at rest and another to pull the whole mounting bracket back as far as it will go, when at rest. That looks like the bigger 5hp tank, (3qt). The smaller 3hp tanks, (1 and 2 qt), are still available from Briggs. That would aid in your tire clearance without the hassle of the new carb and tank. You could gain anywhere from about 3/4 of an inch to 1 1/2 inch of clearance. But, you will have to put the matching smaller pickup tube on your carb.
changing the pickup tube isn't much of an issue for me, I think im gonna go ahead and just get the newer carb off ebay and looking getting some smaller tires at most one size smaller. Those header pipes are freaking awesome! As far as the gas tank I have no idea if my great uncle put a bigger tank on it or not seems like something he would do, and just to mess with people paint it the same color.
I still need to source a need scrub brake pad, does anyone reproduce the aluminum ones?
 
#4
Some 3hp engines had the bigger tank, so it may be original. When it's all said and done, a new carb maybe the easiest and least expensive way to go. You can find Chinese replacement carbs, on ebay, for as little as 20 or so dollars. Just make sure the bolt patterns are the same.
 
#5
Some 3hp engines had the bigger tank, so it may be original. When it's all said and done, a new carb maybe the easiest and least expensive way to go. You can find Chinese replacement carbs, on ebay, for as little as 20 or so dollars. Just make sure the bolt patterns are the same.
Thank you for your input, Ill be going with a newer carb that still bolts to the tank. Ill also look into maybe a smaller set of tires.

Just incase anyone else is having the same problems or thoughts heres the link to the carb Ill be getting
Click here
 
#6
dude you can buy a motor mount plate and just place it under the motor to raise it up some
i made a sandwhitch of plumbers rubber pad for mine so not to scratch up the paint job on the motor plate
or raise it up on fender washers you got plenty room on top
 
#7
I had the same problem with the paint till somebody told me about the clear coat is the one
that is gas proof ....as far as the brake pad i don't know what it looks like to offer a solution
 
#8
dude you can buy a motor mount plate and just place it under the motor to raise it up some
i made a sandwhitch of plumbers rubber pad for mine so not to scratch up the paint job on the motor plate
or raise it up on fender washers you got plenty room on top
I totally cut up some radiator rubber supports off the old unit for my isuzu pickup to cushion the engine lol.
 

I74

Well-Known Member
#9
'Love your Avatar pic. Dude'. !
Good luck with your project, & ''welcome'' to Old Minibikes !!

My Wife's Cousin is: ''Daryl LaMonica''. ;)

I
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Last edited:

markus

Well-Known Member
#14
Just an FYI, your are getting some incorrect information. Your tank is the standard 3hp 2qt size, it is not the oversize tank, if it was you would have never even be able to get close to the engine mount holes in the plate, this photo is the large 3hp on the left compared to the standard on the right, not the difference in the bottom mount, yours is a match to the standard as you can see the center slots for the part that runs up the back rather than being bent right at the bottom of the cut for the bigger tank:



Your block will not have provisions for a bolt on exhaust flange so that will be a problem for a header system. thats not really on your list, but it was mentioned in here somewhere.

the bike is setup for 4.10/3.50x5" tire on 5" wheel in rear so unless you cut the engine plate, and brake assy off and move it all forward, or extend the rear axle mounts and reposition the fender mount strap you not going to be able to use the scrub brake.

Gokartsupply does still list the later made Steel style scrub brake pads, I have not ordered one in many years though so you may want to verify they still have them. Located at the bottom of this page: Gokartsupply brake section

I wont comment on paint, nobody likes the truth on that subject :D

And again, your bike is not a Bird, they ever offered that bike like that, they only offered them in 7/8" tubing and different headtube configuration up to 1969. Yours is a Sears sold specific bike from the 1970's, they went through the Roper corporation. While Bird did have a hand in those bikes, they discontinued anything in their lineup that resembled it (as well as the "Duck" style bikes too) when your bike was being offered.
 
#15
Just an FYI, your are getting some incorrect information. Your tank is the standard 3hp 2qt size, it is not the oversize tank, if it was you would have never even be able to get close to the engine mount holes in the plate, this photo is the large 3hp on the left compared to the standard on the right, not the difference in the bottom mount, yours is a match to the standard as you can see the center slots for the part that runs up the back rather than being bent right at the bottom of the cut for the bigger tank:



Your block will not have provisions for a bolt on exhaust flange so that will be a problem for a header system. thats not really on your list, but it was mentioned in here somewhere.

the bike is setup for 4.10/3.50x5" tire on 5" wheel in rear so unless you cut the engine plate, and brake assy off and move it all forward, or extend the rear axle mounts and reposition the fender mount strap you not going to be able to use the scrub brake.

Gokartsupply does still list the later made Steel style scrub brake pads, I have not ordered one in many years though so you may want to verify they still have them. Located at the bottom of this page: Gokartsupply brake section

I wont comment on paint, nobody likes the truth on that subject :D

And again, your bike is not a Bird, they ever offered that bike like that, they only offered them in 7/8" tubing and different headtube configuration up to 1969. Yours is a Sears sold specific bike from the 1970's, they went through the Roper corporation. While Bird did have a hand in those bikes, they discontinued anything in their lineup that resembled it (as well as the "Duck" style bikes too) when your bike was being offered.

Markus Thank you for that information! I don't know what the stock tire was when I got it but it did still have the original scrub brake. Im not set on these tires, these are just the ones that I had on the shelf from like 10 years ago.

So its a sears runabout? or just some random sears 70's bike? Trying to correctly Identify this thing has been like a lord of the rings adventure. Lets be honest the Paint looks like a smashed bag of assholes, I did the best I could to prep and prime but the reality is I just don't have a great place to point and I should have used something else but im pretty clueless when it comes to all that. I can mechanic almost anything but paint perfection has eluded me. As far as headers go im gonna stick with my mad max leg burner set up

You wouldn't happen to remember or know the stock tire/wheel size for this bike? I still have a 60 tooth sprocket to swap out if I need too.
 

markus

Well-Known Member
#16
Markus Thank you for that information! I don't know what the stock tire was when I got it but it did still have the original scrub brake. Im not set on these tires, these are just the ones that I had on the shelf from like 10 years ago.

So its a sears runabout? or just some random sears 70's bike? Trying to correctly Identify this thing has been like a lord of the rings adventure. Lets be honest the Paint looks like a smashed bag of assholes, I did the best I could to prep and prime but the reality is I just don't have a great place to point and I should have used something else but im pretty clueless when it comes to all that. I can mechanic almost anything but paint perfection has eluded me. As far as headers go im gonna stick with my mad max leg burner set up

You wouldn't happen to remember or know the stock tire/wheel size for this bike? I still have a 60 tooth sprocket to swap out if I need too.
Back when you first came on and asked what it was I posted a catalog shot from sears showing the model, which I think in another post you mentioned you spotted some green paint which is a match to the advertisement/era of that bike I posted. The runabout name wasn't being used at that time like they were in the late 1960's. With that said though, the easiest way to search for info would be to sue the name Wren or Runabout to find bikes and build threads, but you do want to watch sometimes what is said and look at the little differences, if any, compared to the frame your have. Because while they all look the same at first glance, they changed constantly. The tire/wheel size I listed in the info I posted above in this thread.
 
#17
Back when you first came on and asked what it was I posted a catalog shot from sears showing the model, which I think in another post you mentioned you spotted some green paint which is a match to the advertisement/era of that bike I posted. The runabout name wasn't being used at that time like they were in the late 1960's. With that said though, the easiest way to search for info would be to sue the name Wren or Runabout to find bikes and build threads, but you do want to watch sometimes what is said and look at the little differences, if any, compared to the frame your have. Because while they all look the same at first glance, they changed constantly. The tire/wheel size I listed in the info I posted above in this thread.
The small differences between all of them are subtle and sometimes hard to discern, but I appreciate your sage like help. Seems the 6 inch wheel is the stock size but given as i have been unable to source a factory scrub brake I may have to just go with 5 inch tires. Or find a 6 inch tire with a less aggressive tread. Ive still been unable to figure out what the horse head means and I've never seen another one with the support plate around the fork mounting bolt. Im still learning about all this, I wish I could also get another Tecumseh motor but they're few and far between it seems
 
#18
The small differences between all of them are subtle and sometimes hard to discern, but I appreciate your sage like help. Seems the 6 inch wheel is the stock size but given as i have been unable to source a factory scrub brake I may have to just go with 5 inch tires. Or find a 6 inch tire with a less aggressive tread. Ive still been unable to figure out what the horse head means and I've never seen another one with the support plate around the fork mounting bolt. Im still learning about all this, I wish I could also get another Tecumseh motor but they're few and far between it seems
Been thinking about this thread for a while and decided not to let you hang with out getting some more info. It was eluded to, the Robertson Headers can not be adapted to your motor. That's not correct at all. Threaded to bolt on adapters have been around for some time, with a couple different styles to choose from. Here's a link to one such item. As to the tank, I think I pretty well covered that with out getting too far out of line. The paint of the tank can be an issue. After doing a couple searches, I came away with the understanding the high temp engine paint was the best. But I will qualify that by saying, best out of a can. Hope your project is going well. https://farmpartsstore.com/muffler-adapter-690776/?msclkid=71257572c2e71444fa462a5a6022bc46
 
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