Heathkit Hilltopper find and build

#1
I found I had this in the back of the shed and I think I got it while at the minibike meet in CA about 10 years ago.
It looks to be mostly there as I do not know what the bike would have been shipped with.
I found I had the front fender, A seat that is 100%, new tires, the jack shaft and brake is present, and it looks to have had the "light kit" installed.
The kick stand is a strange design and well worn at the pivot/stop?. Never seen another like it.
I have a few engines I can use, 8 HP on down to 3.
I know nothing about these bikes and most post with links here are long dead.
I need two hand brake levers ( 7/8" handlebars ) and the bike is missing handlebar "wing nuts/knobs"
Did the bikes have a brake light or just a running light?
The rear light is FUBAR, no lens and damaged bulb socket.
Were there "boots" on the front spring shocks?
It does not look as though it would take a lot to get it back on the trails.
left side.jpg
Seat, torque converter cover, right side chain guard.

right side.jpg
right side, front fender in background.

front suspension.jpg
Were there shock "boots"?

rear fender.jpg
Rear fender and damaged light.

torque converter.jpg
Jack shaft and brake. Brake has most of the surface left.

head light.jpg
I have a head light that will fit. The bulb is too powerful and will need to be replaced with an LED "bulb"

handlebars.jpg
Were there knobs or Wingnuts to lock the handle bars in place?

gas tank.jpg
Gas tank needs chrome trim replaced. Is that still available?
Any info would be a big help.
Rob.
 

capguncowboy

Well-Known Member
#5
Cool mini!

Lucas Style Taillight

A set of repro Honda Mini-trail knobs are about $30 on ebay, but unknown if the metric thread would be proper.

Otherwise, Carr-Lane sells knobs for bolts/studs that might get you where you need to go.
Metric thread won't work on those. If I recall correctly, you need 1/4-20 knobs. I bought a set of these and they worked great.

https://www.mcmaster.com/catalog/126/2364 style 1, ribbed in 1/4-20 (top knob).

Your other option is to find a set of originals. I have one here, but I don't know how well it will hold up. I've had a few and all but this one have snapped off during removal
 
#6
Thank you all for the great info and links. I do appreciate it.
It looks as though the bike was originally White in color. The flat black paint on it now looks bad,a good reason I got the bike so cheaply.
While I won't restore it to Show Room new, I will ride the stuffing out of it on my mountain trails.
Now I need to determine which engine to throw on it.
The one on the left is an 8HP, it may fit and has a 1" shaft, the white Tecumseh is only three HP and is brand new and never run. That should go to a restorer.
That leaves the Honda 5 HP, the other 3 HP and the 6.5 HP Greyhound engine. I'm leaning towards the 6.5 engine. I'm not sure if any have an alternator flywheel though.
20200330_143413.jpg
I've been offered a set of brake handles that are OEM and use the heavier duty 3/8" barrel cable ends.
I wish I could find a copy of the Heathkit assembly manual.
 

DaddyJohn

Well-Known Member
#7
That jackshaft assembly doesn't look like it leaves a lot of room for a lay-down OHV cylinder arrangement (like the Honda and Greyhound).

I'd agree on the 3hp unit not being ideal powerwise (and for other reasons you mentioned), though it's probably the best in terms of packaging.

It would be interesting to see if that big 8hp fits, but it seems like a HS50 or Briggs 5hp might be most ideal...
 
#10
I spent 10 hours working on the bike today. Weather was good for a change.
After washing the bike today I found the bike was Heathkit Gold as it should have been. I looked around the shop and I did have two 1/4x20 wingnut knobs! What luck!
I put the 5 HP Tecumseh engine on the bike after removing the gas tank and had to make a 1" spacer block in order to raise the air cleaner from hitting the jack-shaft bracket.
I cleaned the carb as the engine has been sitting for 12 years.
This engine was given to me. It had been on a snow blower and ran for one hour when it sucked up some barbed wire and a post and totaled the blower drive ( so I'm told) He said the engine never ran right after that.
I found the engine has very good compression as in new, and the paint on the muffler was not even burned off yet!
The engine was very hard to start. It will rev up but not by the throttle. The governor kicks in at a fairly low RPM ( by ear) and drops the engine back to idle which is also higher than I would think is normal.
Adjusting the carb screws did not help much in lowering the idle speed. The air mixture screw has a blunted point. I don't know if that is normal for this engine or not? Air cleaner looks new.
Spark plug WAS bad! It barely put out an orange spark.
I had a 40 year old lawn mower plug and it sparks like it should. This is what I ran the engine on.
I do NOT hear any odd-ball sounds from the engine. It just will not respond to the throttle being open up all of the way as the engine speeds up a little and the governor kicks in and drops the speed back to idle.
I took photos of the spring on the governor lever and the wire linkage going to the butterfly valve. Both look dodgy to me.
I did add the spring onto the throttle cable for a positive return. Without it the throttle will not close.
I'm hoping you Tecumseh experts can see a problem that can be fixed in the carb linkage?

serial number.jpg

Wing nuts.jpg

engine.jpg

Governor spring.jpg

lftengine complete.jpg
RTengine.jpg
 
Last edited:
#11
The carb has to be modified to allow a proper movement of the butterfly and a throttle plate needs to be added. I may just pull the carb off and replace it with a better design.
Not having a lighting flywheel is also a concern. The Greyhound engine has a four amp flywheel / coils. Time to rethink the engines.
 
#12
When that blower ate the post it may have sheared the flywheel key a bit. That would cause hard starting and poor reving. Also, check the governor arm clamp screw for proper basic adjustment per Tecumseh shop manual.
 
#13
I pulled the flywheel and the keyway and fey shaft are like new.
I do not have the manual and have not been able to find a download,all the links are dead.
 
#14
With the announcement of OldMiniBikes Warehouse shutting down this morning, I will be pulling the Tecumseh engine off of the bike. Parts I needed were to come from him and can be found no where else.
This will give me a good work out to find an engine that parts are readily available,which I have on hand.
 

capguncowboy

Well-Known Member
#15
With the announcement of OldMiniBikes Warehouse shutting down this morning, I will be pulling the Tecumseh engine off of the bike. Parts I needed were to come from him and can be found no where else.
This will give me a good work out to find an engine that parts are readily available,which I have on hand.
What parts do you need? Ebay is a great source if you have the parts numbers
 
#16
It turns out the Greyhound engine ( Honda GX200 clone) will not fit no matter what I would do.
I found my Honda GC160 5HP engine will fit if I modify the throttle. I can make a bracket and mount the throttle cable using the throttle cable stop to prevent over revving the engine since it will bypass the engine governor.
The only problem is the throttle bracket is off of a B&S? I think housing, and the return spring has snapped off. I would like to find another spring if possible.
broken spring1.jpg

broken spring2.jpg

throttle bracket.jpg
 

Attachments

Itype2slo

Well-Known Member
#17
I like the little GC motors, They run great always hard to fit them in with the front exhaust. Some guys have made header pipes for those.
 
#19
The build to running order in on a good path. Since we were told to stay home, I have been spending 10 hours a day after chores, working on the bike. Long days ending with a cold beer or two.
Things that needed to be done that just ate up the hours, more so than you'd think it would take.
The driven pulley had two of three "buttons" broken off. I have yet to determine what model of DP it is as there are no photos of it at Comet parts.
With no parts, or replacements 10-12 dollars for three! I decided to fire up the lathe and make my own out of ballistic nylon.
Pulling the pulley off of the jack shaft was a real pain. I had to use a three-jaw puller and lots of Kroil to get it to budge at all.
Getting the pulley apart took some time as I had no idea how to do it. No snap ring holding it together. Turns out the spider is a left hand thread and with a lot of force, it came apart.
Then to the Comet Drive Clutch. It had been lubed with 3-In-One oil in it's life and it had turned to tar and did not want to come apart. A bath in my heated ultra sound cleaner soon softened up the goo and allowed me to take it apart and lube it properly.
Finding an engine that would fit was a problem. I have several engines on hand, I did not want to buy another one.
I started with a Tecumseh HS50 but the Air Cleaner was hitting the jack shaft brackets. I had to raise the engine one full inch in order to clear the brackets.This then caused all of the drive covers to no longer fit. That was a wasted day.
I then tried a Honda GC160 engine. Getting the throttle to work properly was just not going to happen without some special parts being bought./made ... Plus the front exhaust was going to require a custom pipe to be made.
The Honda GX200 clone was just too large to fit,the head hitting the jack shaft brackets
Back to the HS50. If I took the large air cleaner off and replaced it with a much smaller one it would fit OK. I don't like it and will do a remote air cleaner later on.
Then the rope starter tore in half. Yank the engine off again as the frame prevented the removal of the three head bolts to take the blower housing off. I replaced the rope with a long lasting,heavy duty rope and replaced the oversized "winter" pull handle with a normal one.
I remounted the engine back onto the frame.
Then the carb pooped-out.The float would not allow fuel to enter the bowel. The engine had to be removed again to take the carb apart as the jack shaft brackets are in the way. I found no reason for the needle valve to not open, as all is clean with new parts. I put the engine back on the frame and all is back to normal. All the fuel lines are new and the gas tank is plastic and spotless inside. The valve works as I had gas to the carb.
I then tore the jack shaft apart to clean and check out the bearings,brake, and key ways. The shaft itself was buggered up from years of set screws being over tightened. I had to sand all the high spots off of the shaft. That took a few hours to do and put back together as several of the set screws had the threads torn off or the holes they fit stripped out and had to be retreaded. All these "little"things that had to be done.
The drive chain was ultra sound cleaned as well and is soaking in chain lube overnight. It looks to be almost new with no real wear.
I remounted the front fender and checked alignment.
Brake handles were bought from a member here along with two heavy duty large barrel cables. Their on the way.
The bike is almost ready for a test ride. Painting and all the glitz stuff is a long way off. I just want to get the bike running first as from what I can remember when I bought it ten years ago it has not been running for over 40 years now.
It gives me something to do these "stay-at-home" days and I really don't mind. It's after all a mini bike......
 

DaddyJohn

Well-Known Member
#20
It had been lubed with 3-In-One oil in it's life and it had turned to tar and did not want to come apart.
At least the citronella oil in that 3-in-1 probably kept the bugs away, lol...

Then the rope starter tore in half. Yank the engine off again as the frame prevented the removal of the three head bolts to take the blower housing off. I replaced the rope with a long lasting,heavy duty rope and replaced the oversized "winter" pull handle with a normal one.
Those are definitely the two things I dislike most about the newer Tec motors. Wouldn't keep me from using them though! :)
 
Top