Massimo/MudStar MB200S review/ugrades

Mr. Pink

Well-Known Member
LIVIT, I’ve been closely following your thread on the Massimo MB200S.
I really like your unbiased, thorough review.

I find it very impressive how well Massimo’s customer service is working with you.

I for one, can not stand seeing shoddy workmanship. But I gotta wonder if your expectations were set a bit too high for a $700 piece of Chinese machinery?

Don”t get me wrong, I have plenty of Chinese tools and two first generation DB30’s in my fleet.
The VIN’s indicate they were manufactured in 2008.
The Doodlebugs have exceed MY expectations and most of the tools have lived up to them.

I see on the Massimo website that they have about 150 dealers around the country.
I wonder if inspecting one before you buy would be an option?
 

LIVIT

Well-Known Member
I don't feel expecting to have a rideable product as expecting too much. Apparently Massimo agrees, I just got a phone call. Their head of Marketing has been following me here on FB and on Youtube. He asked if they could send me another new Bike, that will be inspected by him and their head technician and me keep the one I have. If that would be acceptable. Of course I said yes.

So Massimo is obviously aware of the QC issue and is very concerned about it. The Head of Marketing was very sincere in his wanting to make it right with me. So now I'm going to have 2 of these. Wow, not what I was expecting !
 
Dale: Even with all the issues you have had to endure with this bike and CS you have/are receiving over this tells me not to be afraid to pick one up. The fact that they are willing to stand behind it till the customer is happy sez alot these days!
Thank you for your due diligence in keep all of us in the know sir!
 

LIVIT

Well-Known Member
I want to thank y'all for the support, inputs and following me in my "Mini Series" The replacement frame I got seems to be usable. That is not the point. I can accept getting something from china that is not right. But when the dealer "Massimo" sends me something that is not right, then I refuse to accept this. Reason I don't buy direct from china products. I want a distributor to deal with. The American consumer has been too accepting in allowing being sold junk from china and thinking or saying "you got to expect that from china" I for one will not accept this and if we don't stand our ground, nothing will ever be done.

My goal in this was to show y'all the truth about a new product that I felt was a great deal. My feelings on that have not changed. I will always do my best to reveal the good and bad. Guess my tenacious side has shown, I'm very diligent and will not surrender. Even if I don't agree with what someone else is posting to me. I will respect and appreciate the input. Again tks y'all !!!! Dale
 

LIVIT

Well-Known Member
Yesterday I assemble the replacement frame and here we go again. You can see in the pic that the alignment is off again. This is with the axle on brake drum side all the way back and sprocket side pushed more forward. This is Not as bad as my original frame, but it's still out enough to be an issue. If my replacement bike is like this, first thing I will look at when I open the box. Then I'm done with this one ! Yes I can get an adaptor plate or drill the motor plate, which I might do. But it's still going to crab some and I should NOT have to be doing this.

Here is what I think is happening. The frame is not actually bent, this alignment issue is happening during the welding of the 2 halves of frame, then they bend the swingarm to compensate. My original mini was really badly done. So I'm thinking, Massimo sent me a frame that had been returned for the same reason, bad alignment. Trust me my conversation on Monday with the VP of Massimo, Marketing Director and Head tech is going to be interesting !!!

I truly want this MB200S to be a success. I'm really wanting a full suspension mini to build for enduro style riding. I don't really want a TM Hurricane. But if Massimo does not get some QC corrected at the manufacturer then it's not going to happen !
 

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chrisr

Active Member
It may be the picture, but it looks like your wheel is too far to the left if aligned with the fender. If all was straight in stock form, you may want to re-consider your aftermarket addons since that is really not Massimo fault for your alignment issues. Moving the engine plate to the left looks like it would fix this alignment issue if the wheel cannot go to the right.
 

LIVIT

Well-Known Member
It may be the picture, but it looks like your wheel is too far to the left if aligned with the fender. If all was straight in stock form, you may want to re-consider your aftermarket addons since that is really not Massimo fault for your alignment issues. Moving the engine plate to the left looks like it would fix this alignment issue if the wheel cannot go to the right.
You are correct, good observation, it looks that way because I have the axle on the drum side pulled back far as I can and sprocket side pushed all the way forward. Trying to get alignment correct. Same problem with stock engine and jackshaft, actually worse, because I don't have as much adjustment as my riser plate gives me, so it's not my aftermarket stuff. It's a frame alignment issue. I took this same Riser plate, TAV and engine off my CT200U-EX and it had no alignment problems. I have 2 friends with the same mini, using the same riser and TAV with no issues. Yes if I drill new holes in the mounting plate, then I could get it to align better. I did measure the replacement frame, one side is longer than the other. The original frame is even worse. Another and better option would be to cut frame and get it aligned correctly, then weld it back up. Should not have to be doing this with a brand new mini ! If I just use a plate that I can slide engine over further on, then the next issue is, the frame is still out of alignment and the bike will be crabbing. Massimo is aware of this issue, reason why they are working with me to get it corrected and sending me another bike. I'm not alone in having this same problem. Massimo is very concerned about the lack of QC on the MB.
 

Minimichael

Well-Known Member
You are correct, good observation, it looks that way because I have the axle on the drum side pulled back far as I can and sprocket side pushed all the way forward. Trying to get alignment correct. Same problem with stock engine and jackshaft, actually worse, because I don't have as much adjustment as my riser plate gives me, so it's not my aftermarket stuff. It's a frame alignment issue. I took this same Riser plate, TAV and engine off my CT200U-EX and it had no alignment problems. I have 2 friends with the same mini, using the same riser and TAV with no issues. Yes if I drill new holes in the mounting plate, then I could get it to align better. I did measure the replacement frame, one side is longer than the other. The original frame is even worse. Another and better option would be to cut frame and get it aligned correctly, then weld it back up. Should not have to be doing this with a brand new mini ! If I just use a plate that I can slide engine over further on, then the next issue is, the frame is still out of alignment and the bike will be crabbing. Massimo is aware of this issue, reason why they are working with me to get it corrected and sending me another bike. I'm not alone in having this same problem. Massimo is very concerned about the lack of QC on the MB.
I predict somewhere on a welding table in China there's a jig dog out of place. Nobody down the line knows what changed, but they know they're bending to compensate for it. And it's finally taking a patient and knowledgeable consumer to get involved and help the crack the case. Nice work, man. They should send you a lot more than a fresh bike in my opinion.
 

LIVIT

Well-Known Member
I predict somewhere on a welding table in China there's a jig dog out of place. Nobody down the line knows what changed, but they know they're bending to compensate for it. And it's finally taking a patient and knowledgeable consumer to get involved and help the crack the case. Nice work, man. They should send you a lot more than a fresh bike in my opinion.
Tks brother, I'm satisfied with getting to keep what I got and getting another one, but it had best be right !!! Or this is going too blow up.
 
LIVIT,
I really hope they get it right this time !
My frame is right you can tell by the track it leaves . I installed the air shocks with default pressure in them and the springs "loose" , there was one issue the shocks only came with one set of 10mm to 12mm bushings so i had to get another set before i could put them . They raised the rear frame about an inch as i expected from my calc`s . They really make a difference over the stock shocks with a softer ride and they did not change how the bike handles !
Digging thru some old bike stuff i found 3 shock dust cover skins , 2 fit the shocks like a glove the 3rd i cut in half velcroed the 2 pcs around the alum tubes and up the steel shock tubes ,gathered and wire tied them in place above the dust line .
I took it on a 2 mile WFO run on this sandy dusty Rough road ,coming back i could see a solid even track even on the worst sections !! A solid frame leaves gaps in the track out here and the stock shocks you could see the width of the track vary a bit at every "launch and drop " the air shocks made a visible difference of solid constant contact and very little track width variance . I am quite pleased !!
I installed the stage 1 jet and air filter but kept the stock muffler ,wide open my tac shows i gained about 400 rpm (4650+-) and it does accelerate faster now !
Now for the TAV /riser install and 60 T sprocket to put the Grunt and Snort i want out of it .
 
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LIVIT

Well-Known Member
I put the MB engine on my CT200U-EX opened up the flow. Already had put a 60T on it. I was running it with the stock Jack plate and it was rather boring to be honest. I recently put my TAV on it and it's impressive. This stock 196 really seems to be a good one. Only thing about the MB that I'm actually impressed about, so far !
 
Yea it seems to be a good engine ,one of my neighbors who saw the WFO said i was doing about 35 mph both times i passed him .
It is going to take me some time to do the TAV conversion , weather and a lack of undercover work space .
I put in the yellow spring but had to have help preloading the driven with it in position 3 ,talk about night and day difference between it and the red spring that came installed .
I have a question ,the driven came with two washers one keyed and one plain . Is the keyed one necessary at all ? I have seen some use it against the back plate ,some use it between the sprocket and driven and some who did not use it at all ....... Same with the plain washer under the shaft nut ,i can use just one and get the nylock nut to engage , use both and it does not come close .

I am going for the 9 T to 60 T ratio and with the spring in position 3 i am supposed to get max torque at a loss of speed which does not matter to me ........ Opinions ?
 

SAS289

Well-Known Member
I don't use the keyed washer. From what I recall it's because without that washer I do not have to space the drive pully out as far on the PTO. You will see how that all works when you go to align the pullies.

You seem concerned about torque converter to rear sprocket alignment. Perhaps you should use the keyed washer on the jackshaft first, then the sprocket. It would get you closer in alignment. If you are concerned about the nylock portion of the nut just use blue loctite. I've never heard of anyone reporting that the driven nut loosened up. The bolt that holds the drive pulley to the crankshaft is the one to be careful with.
 
I've have seen this chain alignment problem alot on old baja warrior/heat frames, after a tav conversion. Some have been jus add couple shimes, and some have to go complete tear down and start with front and rear wheel centered to frame. If the motor plate has to be replaced, I'll weld in a 1/4" motor plate with 1" square tubing underneath between frame rails. Motor mount bolts go thur the 1"square tubing and engine mount holes. Sounds like overkill, but this reinforces the frame and stops alot of flex in the motor mount and frame. Easily handles big cc torq motors.
Another thing I seen, is new rear wheel sprocket mounts was welded on too far out. Had 3 last year that all measured different. Cut the old off, grind and clean up, weld new on where it should have been. Make sure to leave room between chain and tire. It sucks, and time consuming, but sometimes you jus have to fix stuff yourself to get it right.
Good luck with your new mini, I'm sure you will get it right.
 

LIVIT

Well-Known Member
BrownStainRacing, seems to be a common issue with the manufacturer of these, same as the Baja's. My original even the jackshaft alignment was way off and the replacement frame was not much better.

Got the new MB today, no shipping damage, no alignment issues. It looks good. I actually got to ride it for about 30 mins after I changed the oil and did some break in runs. I had forgotten how much I disliked stock engines with clutches and jackshafts. The seat is a bit stiff feeling, a buddy of mine with same mini and I came up with a way to mount the TM Hurricane/Baja Warrior seat and he said it makes a big difference, so that upgrade and how to do it will be up soon. Looking forward to getting my modified WC 223 and TAV on it and really see what it can handle.

So I now have 2 complete MB200S minis, 1 extra frame and swingarm. Have a guy who is going to fix those 2 bad frames and the swingarm for me, he has a welding and fabricating business. My saltwater fishing guide biz is starting too fire up. So with that and depending on weather it may be a few days before I can get all the upgrades and testing done. Thanks y'all for sticking with me thru the "Mini Series Drama" !
 

LIVIT

Well-Known Member
This has been an interesting and very informative thread and I appreciate every bit of it. I’m certain it will help me with a future purchase for my grandkids. Thanks very much to all of you and I’m glad it worked out.
Thanks y'all !!! My goal in this was to give back too a forum that has personally taught and given me so much. I'm glad it's helping others. One of things I've learned is at times it for sure pays off to be stubborn and persistent. I promise to always post honest unbias opinions. I still think the MB is a decent mini for the price. In that, I feel and told Massimo that they had better get a good hand the QC issues. I will be working with Massimo as an advisor, I will not accept a sponsorship etc... unless they get it right, I did tell them this in several conversations. I will not and cannot be bought off !!

I'm starting on the upgrades today. Looking forward to seeing how this mini handles the stresses I'm going to put it too. Time to "Send It"
 
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