Modded the MM-80 some more, & Just couldn't part with the LIfan 152f-3 80 cc engine yet.

#21
Added,,
The drum will basically oscillate badly, when having end play, as the chain makes it move latterly any way, especially if you don't have your chain alignment ''tits'' 100%, and your sprockets aren't true.
That in turn will wear out the bushing end I.D.'s real quick.
Good job on reading up and using Jim Donovan's chain lube concoction!

The fiber washer that is inserted between the dust cover snap ring and sprocket snap ring is designed to mitigate most of that play. You need some end play so you don't prematurely wear the bushing. In normal use with a decent chain alignment, it does not oscillate, nor cause premature wear on the bushing. Premature being the operative word, since that bushing does need replacement when it wears out.

The only things that cause "premature" wear on the bushing is a clutch brake or a chain that is too tight, or not lubricating the bushing.

These clutches should not be cinched or captured to the PTO, but allowed a bit of lateral movement on the PTO against the PTO shelf, and retaining bolt and washer. This means that your chain alignment does not need to be "tits". In other words, if you have "set screws" in your clutch, remove them. He hasn't used set screws in his clutches for a couple of years now, so any new clutches with them, were shelf stock.

The green spring is an excellent choice for adult riders and vintage mini bike engines. I am also using that set up on a modified flat head engine with a bit more power that has allowed me to "cheat" a little bit on the gear ratio. If I weighed half of what I do, a tighter spring wouldn't matter. (Note the Adult comment) All I use are green springs now, but I do have some clutches I will be using with a black spring for testing later on. I do not use more powerful OHV engines, so I really benefit from some higher RPM engagements.

I have a bunch of fiber washers I found in the UK. They're stupid money on Ebay. I tried doubling them up to reduce end play, and got heat. If you need some, let me know. They are .002" thicker than the stock ones.

Max Torque has been in the business of making these clutches for race karts and mini bikes since 1957, and has learned quite a bit about what works and what does not. We all have opinions, and if you feel Jim has mis-engineered his clutches, or would benefit from running shims, why not give him a call, or shoot him an email and let him know? He will also work with anyone to provide solutions for unique applications.
 
#22
When I was first getting into motorcycles, my older brother would remove the chain from his Triumph, soak it in kerosene and scrub it with a brush, dry it, then cook it in some concoction (I think it contained paraffin, STP and motor oil). That was a long time ago and some very good chain lubes have been developed over the decades that have passed. It's a lot quicker/easier to just spray a chain. Maxima Chain Wax has a paraffin base and is good stuff.
 

I74

Well-Known Member
#23
Thanks for the comments guys. :)
I ' am just ''old school anal'' about getting things as precise as possible.
A lot of that is because of the types of things I worked on ect. throughout my career...
I like to get as much goody out of things as I can, & always try to improve on making stuff last, & run as smooth as possible,, regardless of what it is...
Nothing worse than a bike breaking down, & having to push it home.

The shim I put in, only took up about 1/2 the end play, & there is still plenty there to drop some oil in.;)


Ironically,, I have been looking around town for Maxima chain wax for about a week now, but can't find any so far.
The concoction I came up with, I think is to thin for long term.
The reviews I have read on Maxima chain wax are very impressive.
It will be nice to spray that stuff on, & not have disassemble the chains every time.
 

I74

Well-Known Member
#24
Well, I just changed out the green spring for the black one, & took it for a 1/2 hr. ride.
Definitely hit the sweet spot with going back with the black spring. :)
The shim worked out really well also, and the extra revs with the black spring, really make for a nice smooth transition, especially for accelerating to go up hills.
The clutch is staying pretty cool also, & the drum is just warm to the touch. ;)

There is really good features with the Max torque SS clutch, over the Chinese copy ....
The sintered shoes are really good quality, & the all up weight of it is ''far'' lighter than the Chinese one.
Also having a separate key slot is a big plus, over the integrated ''junk'' Chinese one.
This hub should last for years ….
 

DaddyJohn

Well-Known Member
#25
Ironically,, I have been looking around town for Maxima chain wax for about a week now, but can't find any so far.
I've been using the stuff for over 20 years on my motorcycles, and can vouch for it being the best stuff I've ever come across.

It's available on Amazon for $12.89 shipped for a 13.5 oz can.
 

I74

Well-Known Member
#26
Think I just made out like a fat cat @ Theisens on a 10 ft. roll of DID #35 roller chain. :)
I got a flyer in the mail with a 20% off coupon on 1 item, that's good through the 28th of July.
The DID # 35 roller chain, is made in Japan, & is really good ASA standard, that is shot peened / pre stretched, & well lubed.
Am ''very'' impressed with the quality of this stuff, & for $15.99 after my 20% coupon,, it will give me enough chain to do both bikes, & possibly have enough left over for a spare jack shaft primary chain. ;)
It is night & day better than the stock MM chains, & the other ''junk'' stuff, that I was getting for 2 bucks a foot,, from a certain vendor.:rolleyes:
With the impressive tight precision tolerance of this new chain ect, I think it ought to last for years...

The next size up chain, ''think it's #40 or #41'',, is only 2 more dollars for a 10 ft. roll.
Lastly,,
the 4 pk. of DID master links was only $2.20

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100_5558.JPG
 

I74

Well-Known Member
#28
Thank you for posting this

I noticed a slight performance difference on my drag bike with a good quality chain.
Just replaced the one on the electric, & got back from a 45min ride,, ''what a difference'' !! :p
Thought it was smooth & quiet before,, the new DID chain took it to a new level!
Rechecked the tension about every 20 links or so,, at the top center-''center frame'', with rotating the back wheel,, & it is - ''Even Steven''. ;)
I highly recommend this chain.
I
 
#29
Just replaced the one on the electric, & got back from a 45min ride,, ''what a difference'' !! :p
Thought it was smooth & quiet before,, the new DID chain took it to a new level!
Rechecked the tension about every 20 links or so,, at the top center-''center frame'', with rotating the back wheel,, & it is - ''Even Steven''. ;)
I highly recommend this chain.
I
I’ll def check it out, thanks!
I bought ceramic bearings with some trepidation but they actually did make a noticeable difference which was a pleasant surprise.
Every little bit helps I suppose lol
 

I74

Well-Known Member
#30
Put the new chain on the MM-80 & just got back from a 25 min. spin... ''Much better'' ! ;)
Am waiting on a new back - 15/5/6 - ''Ultimate mini bike street tire'' from GPS, should be here by Thurs.
Actual height on it is supposed to be around 14 1/4.
Stock rear on this bike is wearing really goofy,, think it's separating inside....
Other bike with the same tire on the rear is wearing fine though,, & both alignments & rims are pretty good.
Have about the same run time & course, on both bikes also.
Fronts on both bikes are fine, & hardly show any wear,, even with running on the finished streets in our large Subdivision.
Probably due to around 70+% of the weight with me on them is at the rear.
 
#31
Glad to see somebody giving the little Lifan a chance. I did the same thing with my Doodlebug's original 97cc engine (the flathead G100 copy.) Same jackshaft, green clutch spring. No gov. Then I had my brother mill .045" off the head, jetted the carburetor, and added an ebay header/flange. The little sucker ripped after that. People thought I was crazy, but it really woke it up and was fun to ride. 35mph at over 6000 rpm all day without so much as a hiccup. The Lifan 152 is even better than the 97cc. Lifan has good castings IMO, and I'm not suprised you saw good stuff inside. I have the same engine in my kitchen right now im redoing for my cousins MM-80 bike. It'll get the same treatment as my 97cc and keep him happy for a little bit :D I'm also looking for the 105cc version to play with..............
 

I74

Well-Known Member
#32
Thanks for the kind reply, Fisher. :)
The 152f-''3'', from the research I have done, is average rated @ 3hp.
I like the black spring best with my setup. It actually helps with spooling up for hills, & allows me also to set the idle up, which helps get it moving, especially with my 205lbs. :eek:

6K rpm is ''a lot''.. I run maybe around 4500 tops for short bits, usually when on the flats.
I can contest that mine has been a tough little engine so far.
Definitely put it through the ringer before putting on the jack shaft set up.

Have also been playing around with main jet resizing ...
Bought a bunch of pin drill bits from HF, that go from .5mm, which is about .030,, on up to 3mm.
I stick a small strand of good solder in the hole, & hit the side of the jet with my 430w soldering gun until the solder puddles, I then drill out the center.
Have found the best all around size hole ''so far'' with my mods, is,, .030
If you go over .035, it gets ''way'' to fat, & messes up the other circuits.
In most cases,, you generally get better lower end torque, ''& crisper'',, with running a bit leaner. ;)

I 'am also ''still'' interested in acquiring a 105 -''154f-3'' engine, at some point …..
I
 
#33
You can jet the pilot too. Mine stock was the smallest drill bit in the kit....#80. I think I went to 79 or 78, and played with the adjustable idle mixture screw in my carb until it was just right. It took forever, but I found the magic setting. Which, I cannot remember. All of those parts are now on my nephews 97cc engine and he was amazed at the difference. My brother is working thru the clutch issues as you are and fine tuning it all. Even he was amazed at how much quicker it was. I'm all for 212cc and horsepower, but in some situations, like a kids bike, it's good to maximize the efficiency of the small stock engines.
 

I74

Well-Known Member
#34
Typed the .5 mm conversion wrong, ''oops''..
.5mm is just under .020
.7 mm, is just under .030

Am still looking into a carb with the adjustable idle mixture screw ect.
Have tried a couple of times to loosen the fixed one on mine, but with no results.
Am afraid that it might get narfed up, if I mess with it anymore..
Looks like the screw them in @ the factory, & then bust off the end.
 

I74

Well-Known Member
#35
Just put on the new rear street tire & took it for a spin.
''Night & day difference'' !! :)
I Put 10 lbs. of air in it, & the ride is super smooth.
Has more flex to it than the other tire, & takes the bumps ''way'' better.
Also has a bit more top end with the increased height, am thinking a couple more mph.
Think I will order one for the rear of the electric next, & eventually get 2 more for the fronts of both bikes. ;)
 

I74

Well-Known Member
#39
Thanks Fisher & Nathen. :)
That's an exhaust from a Motovox MBX -11.
It has a custom removable stainless baffle tube in it, that I made from a broom handle.
The baffle makes it quieter, gives it better lower end torque,, & also a nice higher pitch,,, for helping in keeping the neighbors happy. ''LOL''. :p
 

I74

Well-Known Member
#40
Just acquired a new - '' barely run'' GX- 200, that pretty much landed at my feet. :p
Am starting a new thread with swapping that on ect. ;)
Might be letting go of the modded 80cc engine, jackshaft set up,,& pipe.
Send me a PM if interested in that stuff.
I
 
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