MTS-30 Build....questions

#1
Hello Y'all,

I am working to put together the MTS-30 trike I bought for my children.


I bought the trike without motor, or TC driver. My plan is to have it ready for Windber.

Here's what a new one looked like (top photo in the ad below) :


I have some questions about the drive train on ours, and need y'all's help.

The driven unit pictured that came on the trike appears to be stock, measures 7 & 1/8" diameter, is on a 5/8" jackshaft, and the 'notch' formed where the outside and inside plates unite is V shaped, at it's widest point the top of the V measures 3/4".



1 - I want to work with what is there...at least for this season, so I need to know what brand and model that 'driven' unit is ?

2 - next (which will probably be deduced from answer to question 1 :laugh:, I need to know what type of 'driver' is needed to use with the existing driven ?

3 - based on which motor I use, I'll have either a 3/4 or 5/8 inch drive shaft....that said...I don't see any reason
why I can not mix a 3/4" shafted driver with a 5/8" shafted driven...as long as they both accomodate the same width/type of belt....am I thinking correctly :shrug: ?

4 - And lastley, regarding the belt, and the 3/4" V notch driven...will I be looking for a 3/4" V shaped belt...or slightly smaller ?

I can probably figure out the length once I get my motor on there.

Thank you in advance for your help :thumbsup: !

Robert

P.S. Rick Chatten is bringing our fiberglass bucket back to life :thumbsup: ...cause as you can see, it needed some love :laugh:
 
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#2
Hi Robert : From your pictures what you have is a standard V pulley so in Comet units that would be a 20 series driven unit so the driver will have to be the same. In the 20 series the movable faces have to be opposite of each other. I am not sure but your driven might be made by Horstman .
And your unit does not look right the two ramps should be touching with slide bumpers. It may just be not properly assembled.
I bought a Tri Sport RTS 5 because the owner put the driven on backwards and he gave up not finding out why.
The belts back in the day were possibly only 5/8 wide and now they are a full 3/4 inch wide.
So you have Rick working on the project that is a positive move for sure.

This picture is of the RTS 5 that I scored on years back
 
#4
Hi Robert : From your pictures what you have is a standard V pulley so in Comet units that would be a 20 series driven unit so the driver will have to be the same. In the 20 series the movable faces have to be opposite of each other. I am not sure but your driven might be made by Horstman .
And your unit does not look right the two ramps should be touching with slide bumpers. It may just be not properly assembled.
Thank you Steve.

I am going to look up some pictures of the comet 20 series, and Horstman. I don't know enough about v-pulley's or torque converters to know what you mean about mine not looking right...so am hoping I find some pictures that will show me.
 
#5
Are you looking to restore to original or rebuild to running condition

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Thank you W Justice,

For now, looking for the most simple solutioin, as I am wanting for the kids to be able to ride it in Windber next month.

I am hoping that I can literally buy a matching driver and belt to fit one of the engines I have ( I have one motor w/ a 3/4 drive shaft and another with a 5/8" drive shaft ? Any suggestions ?
 
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wjustice

Well-Known Member
#6
Simple solution would be, to me, put a 6.5clone on it. Use a TAV. Remove the rear driven and use a sprocket on the jackshaft with a chain from the tav. Quick easy and you can be running. Restoring and finding a 3hp etc engine, the correct driver AND a belt. Is a longer deal.

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#7
I in my own opinion I don't think that although a cheap way to go that that size of trike needs a 6.5 HP engine with the Torque Convertors gearing their may be too much power for that small trike. The size of the axle shafts might be only 3/4 inch and the size of the brake drums might be also smaller than. The use of a TAV does work if the chosen engine has the 4 bolt pattern to mount the backing plate. On my little Mini Dune buggy I could not use a Briggs 3 HP engine because the TAV out put shaft would hi the fuel tank. So I made my own adjustable jack shaft mount and only used chain drive.

Steve
 
#8
Thank you Steve.

I am going to look up some pictures of the comet 20 series, and Horstman. I don't know enough about v-pulley's or torque converters to know what you mean about mine not looking right...so am hoping I find some pictures that will show me.

I looked at some images of the Comet series 20 driver and driven. That driven sure looks like the same as their 7" series 20 for 5/8" jackshaft...and now I see what you mean about it not looking right....that spring between the two ramps should be compressed...and should have those slide bumpers that you mention Steve.

Any idea why that spring is not compressed ?....is that a 'maintainable/fixable' scenario...or would it be best to completely replace the driven unit ?

Thank you.
 
#9
Hi RobertC : One of the advantages of using a TAC system is that it comes with a belt cover and is pre set width and proper sized belt. But alignment from the drive sprocket might end up over the center of the motor mounting plate. It would be nice to have the TAV mounting plate for measurements and alignment.
Steve
 
#10
Hey Robert
Another solution to get you going for Windber might be to put the torqe converter on hold for now and use a 12 tooth clutch on the engine and replace the existing driven pulley with a sprocket of aprox 18 to 24 teeth
 
#11
Of course I have never been to Windber but it seems to hinge around a big parade and lots of fun in the campground areas. So the use of just a Clutch and sprocket might make sure the project is finished for this event and would give you more time to sort out the use of a TAC.
And I think the gearing that bigrob suggested would give the little trike a good ride.
Steve
 
#12
Hey Robert
Another solution to get you going for Windber might be to put the torqe converter on hold for now and use a 12 tooth clutch on the engine and replace the existing driven pulley with a sprocket of aprox 18 to 24 teeth
Thank you Rob, that is a good idea, and I think that will be my backup plan.

After watching a few youtube videos on torque converters, and looking at more images, and reading what I could find....I went out and messed with the movement of the driven for a bit.

Turns out, that the driven does float on the jackshaft like I would expect. The ramps do have pads on them...they are thin though, I will try to upload another picture. The ramps appeared dis-oriented on the above photo, but I think it was because I'd rolled the frame backwards a bit. I figure it's supposed to be able to move, so I turned it around to where the ramps and the pads meet each other, and am hopefull with a driver and belt, that it will work okay ?

The closest I can pin this driven down to is a Comet 20...but it does not look exactly like the new ones....so that still concerns me a bit...but since I have a little bit of time, (unless anyone advises otherwise..:shrug:) I am going to search this weekend for the best deal on a comet 20 driver to fit the good running little tecumseh 4 hp motor I have....for now I am stealing the motor off my War Eagle...as that little bike is too squirlly for the wife or kids to ride :laugh:

I'll mount the motor this weekend, then when the driver comes in, I'll try it out...and if I can't get that figured out, I'll try replacing the driven with a sprocket.

Thanks again for everyone's input !!
 
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#13
Hi RobertC : My Comet manual is from 1998 - 1999 and by that time the belt width for the converters went to 3/4 inch. About the driven unit floating on the jack shaft it should not float as the alignment of the two components must be exactly in line. The 20 series units have a 30 degree angle in the V where the belt rides.
The TAV system are much different as they have a 20 1/2 degree cross section one side ( The fixed side is almost flat ) and the movable side has most of the taper. And the belts have an arrow to mark witch side goes to the stationary side. In 30 series applications the two movable faces must be on the same plane.

Steve
 
#14
Hey again y'all...I finally got time to get back to work on the trike.

I want you all to look at this, and see if you can advise me on how to get this driven to come off the 5/8" Jack Shaft.

I got me a set of snap ring removers, and was successfull in removing the painted over snap ring.

I can see the keyway, and the key. I've saturated the end of the jackshaft with PB Blaster....and now I am wondering how this driven is supposed to come off of the jackshaft ? :shrug:

I think the fact it'd been painted over is complicating matters....shouldn't I be able to slide the driven off the shaft ? :shrug: Or does the key have to be removed before the driven slide off ?

Here's a couple pictures...note the key, and the key way.

All advise is appreciated :thumbsup:



Thank you !
 
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wjustice

Well-Known Member
#15
I'm fairly sure that it just floats on the shaft. It's stuck from years of sitting. A press can get it off.

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#16
I'm fairly sure that it just floats on the shaft. It's stuck from years of sitting. A press can get it off.

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Thank you WJ...when you say a press....with the jackshaft in place like it is, would a press be more of some type of 'puller' ?

The paint that's on there is loosening up from the pb blaster, and I've scraped a bunch of it away. The key is not sticking out far enough to get a real grip on with my needle nose pliers.

I continue to soak the end of the shaft w pb blaster every half our or so...with hopes it will soak up enough of it to loosen up.
 
#18
Jackshaft is cheap enough. Cut it and save the aggravation and time that you are running out of. Looks like it was welded to the end anyway.
 

wjustice

Well-Known Member
#19
Sorry been busy. As far as to a press, look up item 60604 àt Harbor Freight. That's 12 ton. When I pressed the shaft out on my RTS I hit 15tons before it moved. That was a bigger driven with 3/4" j/s. They can really seize up after 40+ years of neglect.

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#20
Progress to report......

I mentioned earlier in the thread, that Rick Chatten (Chatten63) was working his magic on the fiberglass bucket.....here's a before, and after.

Rick said the color is Roadway Orange, with the top coat, and 1st coat of clear, having metallic flake in it. The flake in the orange should turn gold and silver in the clear. Rick said it's an old trick spray to get both colors in one paint good.

Here's before....you can see it really needed love.....


Here's the bucket after Rick worked his magic :thumbsup:


I can't wait to see it in person, and to see my children's eye's light up when they see this body on their trike.

Thanks Rick....very much !!!
 
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