Predator 212 intermittent spark?

[robgmn]

I went through three pages of posts (plus a forum search) and didn't see this topic, but please feel free to tell me if this has been covered elsewhere.

Brand new Predator 212 mounted and ran for about 45 min. to an hour. Max speed set to about 6MPH so it can break in gently. Motor is mounted at slight angle with the rear about 20mm higher than the front.
My son wanted to ride a little yesterday and started it, but stalled it by giving it gas too soon. Re-started and did the same thing,m then it wouldn't start at all. Even with a little starting fluid in play.

Keeping it simple, I pulled the plug which was pretty wet. I put a screwdriver in the boot and laid it on the cylinder head, but no spark. I tried a different plug and got a spark, but then no spark. I thought maybe the on/off switch so I disconnected it and got spark. Yay. I buttoned it all up and tried to start it, but no love even with some startuing fluid. Pulled plug and it's dry, but no spark again.
My son went back out later and cranked it over at least a hundred times (gas off, spark out but in boot, resting on cylinder head). He said it never failed to spark.

Before I start disassembling things to find the cause, is there anything simple I should be looking for on the outside, or anything common under that flywheel?
I had a similar problem with a Harbor Freight generator and it turned out to be a bad solder joint by the coil, but I'd rather avoid the hassle of pulling it apart if it's a KISS issue.

Thanks for listening.


'69 Roadster. Restored after sitting 35 years in a dirt crawlspace.

 

[DeadPixel]

I would check your coil and see of you fried it. I don't know on a lawn mower coil but on cars I ohm them out. Could also be a miss adjusted coil. Check the distance between the coil and flywheel and make sure it has the proper gap. Make sure the plug is gaped proper too. I am sure you have probably check the plug gap but if not, check it.

 

[SAS289]

Remove that low oil sensor from the system. That eliminates the possibility of it grounding out the coil.

 

[KMC3420]

He said it never failed to spark.

If it never failed to spark, I read this as it is getting spark and it did with every pull, and you stated the plug was wet. You might check your carb float, make sure it isnt sticking at that angle and over fueling. That is an easy check. And as SAS stated, remove the low oil sensor to remove that from the equation.

 

[SAS289]

Another fairly easy way to troubleshoot this is to disconnect the chain from the clutch, then raise the front end of the bike so the engine is level and see how it runs in that position. If it runs fine then you may have a flooding condition as KMC suggested. IMO it is best to troubleshoot engine issues first with the chain disconnected or the rear wheel safely off the ground. After all is well then put a load on it with riding.

 

[DeadPixel]

O ya this could be an oil level sensor problem. Your motor is installed at an angle. Maybe the sensor is not reading the correct oil level due to the install angle. Also don't forget when you check your oil level in the future to do it with motor level.

 

[robgmn]

Looking forward to the end of the work day so i can check it out (though it's snowing, so no riding for him today).

It was only after we went through everything a few times that he went back out and got spark with each pull, so I'm leaning towards the oil sensor idea first since the bike got tilted around while putting it up on the work stand and taking it back down (I'm lazy), the carb second (though I'd hope that a slight angle like that wouldn't cause flooding - imagine going down a steep hill, plus he has ridden it for at least 30 minutes prior to this problem...), and the coil third (do I need a puller to get the flywheel off?).

Again, hopefully it's simple. And I'll update when I find the result (or have more questions

 

[DeadPixel]

No you don't need to pull your flywheel. You don't need to take off the coil either. Take off the one ignition wire, loosen the 2 bolts that hold the coil, place a business card between the coil and flywheel for clearance and re tighten the coil while keeping light pressure on it pushing it in to the flywheel. You want to be able to slide the card in and out but for it to be a snug fit. To check the primary side of coil you check the ignition wire to the iron on the coil and should be some were in the .7 to .9 ohms I think and the secondary side you check the plug wire to the core and should read 6.3K to 7.7K ohms. If you do have any problem with the coil though it would most likely be a clearance problem between coil and flywheel. Pretty good chance though that its your oil level sensor though. A coil problem would more than likely not be an intermittent problem.

 

[Phil1958]

sounds like you might have the choke backwards. wet plug? stalled when gunned?

also don't baby the engine during break-in. give it a good load so the rings seat!

phil

 

[robgmn]

I finally had a chance to check out the motor and my best guess is the oil was low.
I checked it and added some. We got spark on every single pull.
'Buttoned it back up and my son rode for a few hours yesterday, and about an hour today, no problem.

I don't know how the oil sensor works on this, but I'm wondering if the level low enough that it would start, but then level at the sensor would drop just enough to kill the spark.
Unless it acts up again, I'm just going to leave well enough alone.

 

[danford1]

The low oil sensor on Predators cause a lot of grief for A Lot of people. Just unplug the wires coming out of the crank case. You won't have that problem again. Of course, check your oil, keep it full

Danford1