Predator 212 Valve Noise????
- Thread starter tylershg
- Start date
Dang I sure missed a bunch, lol.
These guys are spot on, it needs oil.
I've lost cam lobes on new outta the box engines. Its the exhaust lobe that goes 1st. Im fairley certain it happens in the 1st 30 mins of break in.
I've changed the way I prep the new outta the box engines, all of them not jus preds. No more outta the box, in the vehicle and run it. Some problem would alway show up, eventually. Might be jus a simple carb nuts loosened, side cover bolts backing out. Major problems, oil consumption, new sparkplug covered with oil in just a few hrs.
I suggest, putting the stock springs back in for break in period.
MAKE SURE, all bolts are torqued to spec, valves lashed at .003", coil air gap at .045" for that flywheel with stock coil, stock timing key. The stock carb will be better for break in, its dam near perfect outta the box with that lean stock jet for breaking in. Too much fuel during break in, will wash the rings and they MIGHT NOT ever seat.
Make sure it is mounted down solid, I like it level, most of my builds will be on a level engine plate.
I use 30w oil with a tiny drop of zddp, for break in.
Magnetic drain plugs will show you how much metal comes outta these thing during break in. If you don't have any, do the best you can with what you got.
Start it up and get it above 2500 asap, get that oil splashing!!!!
I use up and down throttle/rpm for the 1st 30 minutes, dont let it set at 1 steady rpm very long, keep it moving, and don't let it under 2500, turn idle screw up if you need to.
After 1st 30 mins, you can do some 2500- WOT quick fast snaps, jus dont hold it WOT.
This changing in rpm will change the temps of the metals. These engines run very cool, it takes awhile to get that oil up to temp
We gotta get that oil up to temp, so try to run it at least 1 hr, more is better, but at least 1 hr, on the 1st day. This is a HOT CYCLE.
After the 1st hr, drain oil, fill it back up with your flavor of break in oil, let it set over night. This is a COLD CYCLE.
Next day, check the bolt torque specs again, not the rod bolts they should be fine since your checked them during the prep.
Flywheel nut, head bolts, side cover bolts. Some might need torqued again, new bolts do stretch.
Always check, set valve lash last, they will be slightly looser then .003" make a note, this will tell you if you are wiping a lobe. Set em again at .003".
Another 1 hr of run time, you can let it set at steady rpm a little longer now, we done got the cam broke in good, hopefully.
Another drain and fill, let sit over night, check bolts again, set valve lash again, make notes again.
My engines stay on the test stand for 4-5 days, getting ran and checked everyday. The bolts and valve lash will eventually stay put, that tells me, it's broke in, and no bolts will come loose. Some minis have to have the engine pulled jus to check/set valve lash.
Let's get some run time, fun time, smiles per hour 1st,....... then we can look at heavier springs, pistons and such.
Hope this helps.
These guys are spot on, it needs oil.
I've lost cam lobes on new outta the box engines. Its the exhaust lobe that goes 1st. Im fairley certain it happens in the 1st 30 mins of break in.
I've changed the way I prep the new outta the box engines, all of them not jus preds. No more outta the box, in the vehicle and run it. Some problem would alway show up, eventually. Might be jus a simple carb nuts loosened, side cover bolts backing out. Major problems, oil consumption, new sparkplug covered with oil in just a few hrs.
I suggest, putting the stock springs back in for break in period.
MAKE SURE, all bolts are torqued to spec, valves lashed at .003", coil air gap at .045" for that flywheel with stock coil, stock timing key. The stock carb will be better for break in, its dam near perfect outta the box with that lean stock jet for breaking in. Too much fuel during break in, will wash the rings and they MIGHT NOT ever seat.
Make sure it is mounted down solid, I like it level, most of my builds will be on a level engine plate.
I use 30w oil with a tiny drop of zddp, for break in.
Magnetic drain plugs will show you how much metal comes outta these thing during break in. If you don't have any, do the best you can with what you got.
Start it up and get it above 2500 asap, get that oil splashing!!!!
I use up and down throttle/rpm for the 1st 30 minutes, dont let it set at 1 steady rpm very long, keep it moving, and don't let it under 2500, turn idle screw up if you need to.
After 1st 30 mins, you can do some 2500- WOT quick fast snaps, jus dont hold it WOT.
This changing in rpm will change the temps of the metals. These engines run very cool, it takes awhile to get that oil up to temp
We gotta get that oil up to temp, so try to run it at least 1 hr, more is better, but at least 1 hr, on the 1st day. This is a HOT CYCLE.
After the 1st hr, drain oil, fill it back up with your flavor of break in oil, let it set over night. This is a COLD CYCLE.
Next day, check the bolt torque specs again, not the rod bolts they should be fine since your checked them during the prep.
Flywheel nut, head bolts, side cover bolts. Some might need torqued again, new bolts do stretch.
Always check, set valve lash last, they will be slightly looser then .003" make a note, this will tell you if you are wiping a lobe. Set em again at .003".
Another 1 hr of run time, you can let it set at steady rpm a little longer now, we done got the cam broke in good, hopefully.
Another drain and fill, let sit over night, check bolts again, set valve lash again, make notes again.
My engines stay on the test stand for 4-5 days, getting ran and checked everyday. The bolts and valve lash will eventually stay put, that tells me, it's broke in, and no bolts will come loose. Some minis have to have the engine pulled jus to check/set valve lash.
Let's get some run time, fun time, smiles per hour 1st,....... then we can look at heavier springs, pistons and such.
Hope this helps.
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this helps so much you don't even know. so the whole time it's just because it wasn't broken in. so nothing was wrong at all. well atleast we all gave it a good inspection. I'm so thankful for you out of everyone since you've stuck here from the start. I will do everything you say when I am home tommorow. Thanks to everyone that helped me. I'll be sure to stick in the community and help others as I gain more experience!!!
ok guys I bought a magnetic dipstick and I'm breaking it in with high zinc oil. I swapped in the stock springs like you guys told me too. I'm going to add a video of how it sounds just to make sure it sounds good with you guys.
https://youtube.com/shorts/xxripdZZmbk?feature=share
https://youtube.com/shorts/xxripdZZmbk?feature=share
I would like take the time, on this historic occasion, to pinpoint tylershg as my favorite person asking questions about internal engine problems. He answered all questions asked by the group, he went out of his way to try exactly what we suggested and he told us about what his results were. We never once heard about "Herman the Moterman" on you tube.
Nice job tylershg . Please stick around. Thanks to your input, I am sure you will be riding this summer. Have fun and be safe.
Dave
Nice job tylershg . Please stick around. Thanks to your input, I am sure you will be riding this summer. Have fun and be safe.
Dave
awwww man thank you so much. you were one of the most helpful people I've ever seen on the internet. I will defiently continue to stick around after seeing hoe helpful and amazing this community is. and yes I did try my best not to be one of those people that just leave you guys without any answer on whether it worked or not. I will have a blast on my bike for a long time to come. happy riding! byeeee
Yes, this is a good thread with good info shared and a thread that, unlike some, has a beginning and an end (or a resolution). Some people that pose questions never come back and don't have the patience that Tylershg has. Threads typically die when the OP gives up. Good job everyone!
You mean magnetic drain plug, right?
In that video I do hear the typical OHV pushrod tick-tick-tick-tick-tick sound but that is normal, at least to me. I'm surprised I can hear it actually as phone microphones aren't the best in the world and often can't differentiate anything that's "hiding" under the loudest sound which is usually/always the exhaust.
You mean magnetic drain plug, right?
In that video I do hear the typical OHV pushrod tick-tick-tick-tick-tick sound but that is normal, at least to me. I'm surprised I can hear it actually as phone microphones aren't the best in the world and often can't differentiate anything that's "hiding" under the loudest sound which is usually/always the exhaust.
Oh neat-o. I have never seen a magnetized metal dip stick like that before.
That is a neat piece of kit--it means you can keep removing metal particles every time you check the oil instead of only every time you change the oil (with a magnetic drain plug). Just wipe the metal particles off the dip stick.
That is a neat piece of kit--it means you can keep removing metal particles every time you check the oil instead of only every time you change the oil (with a magnetic drain plug). Just wipe the metal particles off the dip stick.
Oh neat-o. I have never seen a magnetized metal dip stick like that before.
That is a neat piece of kit--it means you can keep removing metal particles every time you check the oil instead of only every time you change the oil (with a magnetic drain plug). Just wipe the metal particles off the dip stick.
That is a neat piece of kit--it means you can keep removing metal particles every time you check the oil instead of only every time you change the oil (with a magnetic drain plug). Just wipe the metal particles off the dip stick.