Predator 224 differences?

[Fisher1983]

Morning, I've been reading into the Predator 224 engines, and I have a few questions. Apparently there is a Hemi version, and it appears undesirable. Why? Second, the non-Hemi version seems to have some balance issues and also a loose flywheel nut due to the thicker cooling fan. Has this been taken care of from the factory, or are people using washers to fix the problem? Finally, are they worth it? I was also looking into the Wildcat 223 from EC carbs and it seems like a better deal with the PVL flywheel and other trinkets out of the box. But, I know little about the other stroked engines so I'm open to opinions and info sharing. Considering a 224 for my CT200U eventually.

 

[SAS289]

The Predator 224 thing is a mess. Guys are buying them and getting a hemi. I hear they are putting hemi's in non-hemi boxes. Turns out the hemi is a turd that would work only as a utility engine or governed stock engine for minibikes and go karts. Avoid the 224 hemi like the plague.

Harbor Freight Predator 224cc Hemi - ARC Racing

The Wildcat 223 is always out of stock.

Solution is the Ducar 224. DUCAR 224cc Builders Racing Engine

Didn't need it but I got a Predator 224 only weeks after its release in early 2022 and built it. Lot of torque. I didn't like the bloated blower housing and starter cup so I used clone parts. Once you get a flywheel you don't need the tall fan. You mention the flywheel nut. I disassembled the day I got it. By the sound of my impact gun the flywheel nut had to be not torqued to spec. Spun off way too easy.

In my opinion the 224 (non hemi) is the best engine from Harbor Freight. I could have torn down my built 196 and used its flywheel, rod, and cam in the 224. You can't do that with the Predator 212's. With it's 7/8" ID inlet the stock 224 muffler is a good one.

 

[Fisher1983]

The Predator 224 thing is a mess. Guys are buying them and getting a hemi. I hear they are putting hemi's in non-hemi boxes. Turns out the hemi is a turd that would work only as a utility engine or governed stock engine for minibikes and go karts. Avoid the 224 hemi like the plague.

Harbor Freight Predator 224cc Hemi - ARC Racing

The Wildcat 223 is always out of stock.

Solution is the Ducar 224. DUCAR 224cc Builders Racing Engine

Didn't need it but I got a Predator 224 only weeks after its release in early 2022 and built it. Lot of torque. I didn't like the bloated blower housing and starter cup so I used clone parts. Once you get a flywheel you don't need the tall fan. You mention the flywheel nut. I disassembled the day I got it. By the sound of my impact gun the flywheel nut had to be not torqued to spec. Spun off way too easy.

In my opinion the 224 (non hemi) is the best engine from Harbor Freight. I could have torn down my built 196 and used its flywheel, rod, and cam in the 224. You can't do that with the Predator 212's. With it's 7/8" ID inlet the stock 224 muffler is a good one.

Excellent info....thank you. I just read that ARC page earlier today. I see what everyone means now. Funny how HF is putting Hemi's in non-Hemi boxes....they're doing that with 212's too. I went to my HF today for a tool and every 69730 with the "regular" 212 pic on the box contained a Hemi. I looked through the box handle hole at the valve cover. The part # 60363 no longer exists but they're still peddling the Hemi's. Actually makes me consider one....I have had 4 of them and love them and it'd be fun to do a total build on one.

Anyway, what did you do to your non-Hemi 224 as far as parts? You mentioned a flywheel. Did you use the clone blower housing, cup, and pull start too? I'd be interested in building one of those out. Does it still vibrate like a sonofagun? That's the other thing I read about that got me thinking....apparently between the China quality, long stroke, and not tight flywheel, they will shake like a jackhammer. I'm not all about that at my age. But, I still love torque!!! The 7/8 muffler has me intrigued....I read somewhere else that the 224 air box and muffler is actually considered a higher flowing performance upgrade for a 196 or 212 without increasing noise. I REALLY like that idea since I ride in a sub. I have the OldMiniBikes header and sausage muffler for my 196 and it can be a little loud sometimes.

 

[SAS289]

For my 224 build I used the 6270 billet rod, .570 CH flat top, 252 Rattlesnake cam, 22lb springs, PVL flywheel, and Champion rockers. I originally used a stock carb but it now has a VM22. And yes, blower housing, pull start, and starter cup from my Hisun 196. With the Coleman tank it doesn't look like a 224.

I did my build before they came out with pre clearanced 224 cams. There were 4 points on the block that needed clearanced.

It does not shake or vibrate.

Not sure about the air box but the muffler is an upgrade for 196/212. I use it on my built 196 and it works ok with a VM22 carb. I do not have to retune if I put a header pipe on it.

 

[panchothedog]

I have two of the non hemi 224's ( and several 212's ). The extra torque is easily worth the difference in price in my opinion. Seat of the pants, you can feel the extra pulling power. Both of mine have the cams that were already clearenced. But the billet rod still needs the block to be ground on in three or four places. Pretty strong runner right out of the box, if you're not into modifying them.

 

[SAS289]

I have two of the non hemi 224's ( and several 212's ). The extra torque is easily worth the difference in price in my opinion. Seat of the pants, you can feel the extra pulling power. Both of mine have the cams that were already clearenced. But the billet rod still needs the block to be ground on in three or four places. Pretty strong runner right out of the box, if you're not into modifying them.

Agree. I should have ran mine out of the box. There's a good chance that I wouldn't have built it.

 

[Fisher1983]

Agree. I should have ran mine out of the box. There's a good chance that I wouldn't have built it.

Box stock..........do you think they would tolerate 4500 rpm all day with a stock flywheel and plastic geared cam? I just did my gear ratio chart and with my 44 tooth sprocket (8.8:1 overall ratio) I need 4500 rpm to get me at 30mph. (I'm not building a speed queen...just a torquey backyard bruiser.) I could even go down to a 40 tooth for 8:1 and 30mph comes at 4200.

 

[SAS289]

4500 max? Yes. Same with the rod, flywheel, and internal governor parts.

Let's be real here... Look at the Ghost 212 which has a 6K to 6100 RPM rev limiting coil. It's rod and flywheel are no better than any other stock rod and flywheel.

If 6100 RPM's make you nervous then get a 5200 RPM rev limiter from EC carbs. I would run a plastic cam and stock engine with it. You just wouldn't want to be on and off the limiter too much.
5200rpm Rev Limited Ignition Coil for Predator/Clone 212/224cc Engines

 

[Fisher1983]

4500 max? Yes. Same with the rod, flywheel, and internal governor parts.

Let's be real here... Look at the Ghost 212 which has a 6K to 6100 RPM rev limiting coil. It's rod and flywheel are no better than any other stock rod and flywheel.

If 6100 RPM's make you nervous then get a 5200 RPM rev limiter from EC carbs. I would run a plastic cam and stock engine with it. You just wouldn't want to be on and off the limiter too much.
5200rpm Rev Limited Ignition Coil for Predator/Clone 212/224cc Engines

I appreciate all the info. It sounds like I don't have to "build" it at all. Maybe swap the fan/starter cup/tins for the 196 stuff (I also don't like the bulky looking 224 tins.) Reading more, it looks like the 212 Hemi metal cam fits the 224 if folks are upset about the plastic.

 

[panchothedog]

If you don't go crazy on the rpm's, and stay with the stock valve springs, you'll probably be O K with the stock plastic geared cam.

 

[dbrick]

Need some opinions. 224 is on sale.
So for bone stock bolt it in and run it, I can get a 224 hemi, or I have a Carol stream 212 elec start I've been sitting on, or buy a new hf 212.
This is for a Snowco trike, it will be a bone stock and governed engine.
Thanks

 

[SAS289]

Use what you already have.

 

[sparkwizard]

Save your money for later. Use what you already have.