You said it runs and gets you around pretty well. A torque converter will be a huge improvement all around. You seem like you have a problem installing a torque converter on an engine that is already on the bike frame. May I suggest that you avoid even trying to install a larger engine and a torque converter and possibly ending up with a basket full of parts that you can't ride? This is a hobby. We tinker. We have fun working on our projects. I suggest that you ease into this. Do not jump into a bunch of performance improvements that you may not have the tools or knowledge to accomplish.
Throttle cable direct link to the governor lever for bypassing governor?
- Thread starter bpjacobsen
- Start date
Assuming your clutch has 12 teeth, and your rear sprocket is 72 teeth, you have 6 to 1 gearing.
With a torque converter starting out at 6:1, times your 6:1 to the wheel, you have 36:1 low gearing at start off. That would be SIX TIMES the torque for climbing hills, wheelies and rapid acceleration. As your speed increases, your gear ratio will decrease until you are somewhere around 4:1 assuming you are on level ground and your tires are not going flat. That should get you a little bit over 25 MPH with no wind. Hope this helps.
Oh, and if you find a video telling how to install a torque converter on one engine, the instructions are IDENTICAL for another engine.
Do not confuse yourself worrying about the governor. That is what keeps you safe and keeps your engine running and reliable.
With a torque converter starting out at 6:1, times your 6:1 to the wheel, you have 36:1 low gearing at start off. That would be SIX TIMES the torque for climbing hills, wheelies and rapid acceleration. As your speed increases, your gear ratio will decrease until you are somewhere around 4:1 assuming you are on level ground and your tires are not going flat. That should get you a little bit over 25 MPH with no wind. Hope this helps.
Oh, and if you find a video telling how to install a torque converter on one engine, the instructions are IDENTICAL for another engine.
Do not confuse yourself worrying about the governor. That is what keeps you safe and keeps your engine running and reliable.
For the 30 series with a 6" driven you get 2.68 ratio in low and .9:1 overdrive in high. With 6:1 gearing he would get 16:1 in low and 5.4:1 in high.
The low end would be nice for his bike but once the belt shifts I think the gearing change would hurt performance with the smaller engine. And engine power is being lost to friction with the torque converter in the first place. The engine would be working against more friction and load from the gearing change. I don't think a torque converter is a good idea for this bike because of engine size.
The low end would be nice for his bike but once the belt shifts I think the gearing change would hurt performance with the smaller engine. And engine power is being lost to friction with the torque converter in the first place. The engine would be working against more friction and load from the gearing change. I don't think a torque converter is a good idea for this bike because of engine size.
The engine would not have the torque to spin enough RPM to shift the belt all the way out unless the bike was going down hill.
The torque converter is a centrifugal pulley that depends on RPM, right?
Ever seen 3 and 3.5 engines with torque converters? This example is 4 HP.
I do not disagree with your statement, but if it doesn't have the torque to spin the driven fast enough, the weights wont fly out far enough to go into overdrive. It is self limiting.
The torque converter is a centrifugal pulley that depends on RPM, right?
Ever seen 3 and 3.5 engines with torque converters? This example is 4 HP.
I do not disagree with your statement, but if it doesn't have the torque to spin the driven fast enough, the weights wont fly out far enough to go into overdrive. It is self limiting.
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How would like that answer quantified? Top speed rated from one to ten? Uphill climbing in sand? How difficult it will be to keep the front wheel down?
It is really difficult to explain "how much better" something can be. The 212 would have quite a bit more torque. They are both governed at the same RPM. The 212 might not fit in your frame. With similar gearing, your top speed should be the same on flat level road. Uphill or in sand, the 212, with more torque could maintain more speed.
It is really difficult to explain "how much better" something can be. The 212 would have quite a bit more torque. They are both governed at the same RPM. The 212 might not fit in your frame. With similar gearing, your top speed should be the same on flat level road. Uphill or in sand, the 212, with more torque could maintain more speed.
The 212 predator is a pretty strong engine, even in stock format. i've put them on china doodlebugs and that motor, with a torque converter, in stock format (well except the governor disabled), made that doodlebug down right dangerous. torque converters, regardless of the engine size, are the bomb. but that said, if the gearing is too tall, then the effects of the torque converter are severely diminished.
i usually buy one of those $60 series30 torque converter kits for general use. they have the mount plate, and have two sprockets (#35 and #41) in the kit. it does not set up your gearing, but it's generally a good start. if the gearing seems wrong, from there you can figure out if you need to change any sprockets for better gearing, and the type of riding you're doing
i usually buy one of those $60 series30 torque converter kits for general use. they have the mount plate, and have two sprockets (#35 and #41) in the kit. it does not set up your gearing, but it's generally a good start. if the gearing seems wrong, from there you can figure out if you need to change any sprockets for better gearing, and the type of riding you're doing
I don't know a lot about torque converters, at this time all my bikes have clutches. Although those are really cool looking mini's, they like to pull the front end up with the stock sprocket and a bigger motor. My brother put the 196cc off of his colman on one with a clutch not a TC and you simply couldn't keep the front wheel on the ground. If you end up using a larger engine be very careful the first time you try to ride it. As I said I can't speak about TC's on that bike.
Well folks, y'all have been really really helpful. Now at least I can make a more informed decision. honestly, I have pulled wheelies on this thing without much effort. I mean, I'm 200 pounds (hoping to lose about 10 LOL) so yeah, a little guy like this won't take much effort for me to pop wheelies. However, I can see how a TC would make this go better on trails. Just not sure it's gonna be worth it for this bike since the tires are not really full on ATV like the bajas are. It's great in grass and flat dirt/gravel etc but not sure about rougher terrain. Not to mention, the suspension is really nothing special so likely best to keep as is for now. Growing up, I had a 125 3 wheeler (suzuki ALT) and the matching 4 wheeler in orange. lol also had a CR125 Honda 2 cycle dirt bike and a Yamaha Warrior 350 quad. So plenty of experience riding various toys. lol gotta say though, been enjoying the heck outta this little Manco. Just a lot of fun to cruise around on. House backs up to township land with a hill so it's really fun coming back up that hill to the house. lol. If I had a coleman baja bike then I think a TC might be more beneficial. Dunno, maybe I'll break out and get one anyway and see what happens. lol. I do like to build and mod stuff and very handy. Just never did one of these. Cheers!
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