automatic spark advance

#1
I was just pondering why dont small engines need an automatic spark advance to run properly? I looked in a small engine book i have and it appears kohler engines had weights to do so on the cam gear. Am i missing something here
 
#2
They don't usually get a whole lot of RPM's so it doesn't necessarily need it. It's just set up to run great at one speed and close as it can everywhere else.. Most all boat motors have it.
 
#3
so would you say it would be beneficial to have an adavance in our application? I would think kart racers would have thought of this by now and come up with an aftermarket solution
 
#5
so would you say it would be beneficial to have an adavance in our application? I would think kart racers would have thought of this by now and come up with an aftermarket solution
I don't know... I have thought the SAME damn thing though.. I know they just alter their timing on the flywheel or key and just advance where they want it set for on the racing engines. I have pondered that one myself many a time.. :rolleyes: All you'd have to do is build a bracket that would allow your coil to turn around the flywheel some like the boat motor ones do... getting the ignition curb and stuff right for the rpms and the cam and stuff would be the bitch of it all. :doah: You'd almost have to use the governor or something to tell your coil where to be to match the RPM's though.. Who knows? A lot of building for what it is. :doah: Not like I haven't done it before though I guess... :doah: lol
 
#6
Honda Trail 70s with the 3 spd engines did not have timing advance either maybe a few other models. I,m wonder if they thought it might more reliable with out timing advance. I would guess that TRK maybe right, the engines we use on minibikes were only design to maintain 3600 rpm original so they did not see a need for it.
 
#7
Probably the easiest way would be to rig up a spark advance computer like a MSD. You could use the points to activate it and use an external coil to fire the plug. Some of those MSD units allow you to custom set an advace curve.
 

vette66_00

Active Member
#8
Honda Trail 70s with the 3 spd engines did not have timing advance either maybe a few other models. I,m wonder if they thought it might more reliable with out timing advance. I would guess that TRK maybe right, the engines we use on minibikes were only design to maintain 3600 rpm original so they did not see a need for it.
But the Trail 90's did with weights.

Also guys did you know your motors are already around 23 deg advanced? And as you get into the high rpm's it will drop or retard about 7-9 deg leaving you at 14-16 deg advanced.




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#9
The Ct70 4 speed engines had the spark advancer on them , also my Briggs Animal has a built in Spark advance in the modual ,, it was suppose to be one of the latest versions :wink:
 

65ShelbyClone

Well-Known Member
#10
1.) I was just pondering why dont small engines need an automatic spark advance to run properly?

2.) I looked in a small engine book i have and it appears kohler engines had weights to do so on the cam gear. Am i missing something here
1.) They are designed to spend the majority of their useful life at a steady 3600rpm with WOT. Advance curves are for engines that will see a lot of use in transient conditions like below redline or throttle variations. Even they can function fine with "locked" timing, but response is better when the timing can somewhat compensate for load.

2.) Much to their credit, Kohlers were built like single-cylinder automotive engines of the time. as a result, they were better than Briggs or Tecumseh(with a price to match) and I'm not at all surprised they had centrifugal spark advance.

In the end, yes, a nonlinear spark advance is beneficial. With locked timing, you can really only aim for the right amount of advance in a narrow range of RPM. Ideally the ignition controller would be programmable in relation to RPM and manifold pressure or throttle position.
 
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