Old Copper Colored 6.5 hp

kawazukimaha

kawazukimaha

New Member
#1
#1
I've had this motor for 20 years. It was old when I got it! I had it on a go cart to ride with my son on his go cart. It always ran very good. Just been sitting in the garage, since I sold the carts. Is there an electronic ignition conversion available? The points are always a concern for tuning and reliability. I am interested in doing a Mini Bike build with this motor. Probably would not do a high revving application. Maybe a torque converter and taller gearing for decent cruising speed. Any tips or recommendations?
 
The Restore Kid

The Restore Kid

New Member
#5
#5
OH hell copper goes back into the 50's.. It sounds like the old 6 horse flatty...

Yes, you can get EIC for them, but if your flywheel has two magnets, you will need to get the newer flywheel as well..

As long as it is into the 1960's and has the modern points, all you need to do is change out the coil to the 7 or 8 horse EIC oil..
 
MoTo-BunnY

MoTo-BunnY

Member
#6
#6
The copper Briggs were always my fave color. . .dunno about a 6.5 that old though..... they had 5 3/4HP motors later changed to 6HP in the early '60s but I have never seen an old 6.5HP?

The copper color actually goes back into at least the mid 1960s and then ends in the later '70s (I have a 1965 4HP factory copper engine as my oldest and I think a 1975 5HP is my newest).

Yeah, like TRK was referring to, check the polarity on the flywheel if if is old enough (like early '60s or older), they used a different polarity on the older motors that isn't compatible with newer components like the magnatron (though you used to be able to send the flywheel to Briggs to be re-polarized though, I guess, but I would doubt they still do that).

I actually picked up a way cool polarity tester from Amazon that LED lights one N or S, depending on polarity, but you can use a compass to do this, too.

Post some pictures and especially the engine code (likely on the left side of the fan shroud or, if REALLY old, on a metal tag on the back). :thumbsup:
 
kawazukimaha

kawazukimaha

New Member
#7
#7
I actually dug this thing out of the depths of my garage today. I misspoke it is a 6.0 HP. S/N 744572 stamped in the cowl is 146432 0536-6706261. I believe that makes it a 67 model?

Pics:






 
Beal

Beal

Member
#9
#9
Thats a neat engine. I like the improvised tinwork there.

I have a 5hp that was this copper color, Id like to restore it to its former copper-esque-ness. Does anyone know what that color is called?
 
kawazukimaha

kawazukimaha

New Member
#12
#12
A little more information from Wikapedia: Probably old information for this group.
Interesting.


The aluminum engine – This was introduced in 1953 as a means of having a lighter-weight engine for applications such as rotary lawn mowers. It was improved five years later in 1958 with the introduction of the Kool-Bore (all aluminum) and Sleeve-Bore (aluminum, with a cast iron cylinder liner).

Easy-Spin Starting – This compression release, implemented as an extra hump on the intake lobe of the camshaft, was introduced in 1961 to reduce the effort required to start an engine.[10] In 1982, a new U.S. federal safety regulation required lawnmower blades to stop spinning within three seconds of the operator letting go of the handle. The least costly, most common way of complying with the new regulation was to put a flywheel brake on the mower engine, to stop the engine (and therefore the blade) immediately when the handle was released. Briggs & Stratton engineers found engines with the Easy-Spin camshaft were unacceptably difficult to restart after being braked to a quick stop. The Easy-Spin lobe hump was moved to the exhaust valve, but this reduced engine performance. The intake-side Easy-Spin remained in use on Briggs & Stratton's engines larger than those used on mowers subject to the brake requirement, but was discontinued in 1997 due to tightening emission regulations.[11]

The Synchro-Balanced Engine – This 1966 innovation was designed to attenuate vibration caused by the reciprocating mass of a single-cylinder engine. The design was a series of counterweights opposing the crankpin.[12]

The Twin Cylinder Engine – This engine was introduced in 1977 as a means of competing with Briggs & Stratton's rivals, particularly Japanese firms like Honda who were cutting into traditional Briggs & Stratton markets by producing lawn mower engines (and later, complete lawn mowers). These first models were rated 16 hp (11.9 kW) and displaced 40 cubic inches (656 cc), but were joined in 1979 by 42 cubic inch (694 cc) models rated at 18 hp (13.4 kW). The original price for the 16 hp (12 kW) version was $70 lower (at US$228) than their single-cylinder cast-iron version bearing the same power rating.[13]

Industrial/Commercial (I/C) – This series of engines, initially ranging from 3 to 18 hp (13 kW), was introduced in 1979 as Briggs & Stratton's answer to high quality commercial-duty engines produced by competitors. These engines include heavy-duty features such as Stellite exhaust valves, upgraded bearings, cast iron sleeved cylinder bores and high-capacity air cleaners.[14]

Briggs & Stratton HYBRID – In 1980, at the tail end of the energy crisis, Briggs & Stratton developed the first gasoline-electric hybrid automobile. "The Hybrid" was designed by Brooks Stevens and powered by a twin-cylinder 16 hp (11.9 kW) Briggs & Stratton engine and a large electric battery.

Magnetron Ignition – This solid state ignition system introduced by Briggs & Stratton in 1982[15] eliminated the points and condenser system, the performance of which steadily degraded between required periodic maintenance service. Magnetron was made available for retrofitment to Briggs & Stratton engines made since 1963. Competitor Tecumseh had made a capacitor discharge ignition setup since 1968 for their cast iron engine models, expanding its availability and making it standard equipment on vertical shaft engines powering lawn mowers in late 1976, five years before the advent of the Briggs Magnetron. Defunct competitor Clinton Engines commercialized a piezo "Spark Pump" ignition without breaker points in the early 1960s.[16]
 
MoTo-BunnY

MoTo-BunnY

Member
#13
#13
Yep, neat 1967 engine there with custom mods galore! Most of my engines that color are from the early 1970s, but as you can see they were some a bit older too.

I have read a few posts on folks trying to duplicate that copper color with modern paints but I don't think anyone has nailed it dead-on yet? (probably, as with many of the old-timey paints, modern EPA regs negate modern use of some of the components of the original formula)

Interesting factoid on that copper color on engines left out in the sun a lot, it fades out to a silver color....so much so that you can't even tell it was originally copper until you take some tin off the engine (and see the copper underneath that didn't get sun faded!) :laugh:
 
kawazukimaha

kawazukimaha

New Member
#14
#14
Yeah, I think it is pretty cool. It is one of those things that when and if I do a project with it, I'd be hard pressed to sell it. The clutch belt drive works really well. I'd like to find the right match for it, go through it, get the copper color as close as possible and do a classic bike. Maybe go with some modern add ons.

The tank is off an old Coleman genset. The guy I bought it from had an ole timey motor shop / scrap yard. He wanted me to bring the tank back and swap it for the right tank.He expected to get one in time. He said the Coleman tank was worth more than the engine, at the time. I went back there a couple of months later, at least twice, it was closed. I later found out that he had passed.

I am thinking the tank may go well with a mini bike build. It has 4 studs built in to the under body of the tank. Many options for mounting posibilities. Since it has a tunnel formation, I would think a horizontal position relative to the rider would work best on the right frame.
 
The Restore Kid

The Restore Kid

New Member
#19
#19
MoTo-BunnY said:
you used to be able to send the flywheel to Briggs to be re-polarized though, I guess, but I would doubt they still do that.
Click to expand...

:confused: thats pretty tricky.. :laugh:

MoTo-BunnY said:
I actually picked up a way cool polarity tester from Amazon that LED lights one N or S, depending on polarity, but you can use a compass to do this, too.
Click to expand...
:confused: They make everything now days.. :laugh:

I just use another magnet, then make em all act the same way and figure it must be rite.. :laugh:

kawazukimaha said:
I actually dug this thing out of the depths of my garage today. I misspoke it is a 6.0 HP. S/N 744572 stamped in the cowl is 146432 0536-6706261. I believe that makes it a 67 model?

Pics:
Click to expand...
Yeah thats 60's 70's 80's model.. The older 50's engines had the B/S logo stamped into the shroud.. Older carbs have 3 screws holding the bowl together, newer ones are 4... Tote Gote and some other bikes used engines just like that..

That deal on the back is a clutch, although they are made for just pulling a rotating mass of some kind.. They aren't made for pulling a load.. If you put it on a bike you'll need NEED NEED a jackshaft system, so you can not only drive a LARGE PULLEY, at least probably 8 inches in diameter, so you can achieve near a correct gear ratio AND PULL something...

The pulley diameter being like 3 inches, makes a HUGE gear ratio.. doing like 70 MPH...

PROBLEM with that is, a belt will slip like hell, trying to pull 28 MPH..

They are just made so you can start up yur concrete float without turning the whole head...:shrug:


5horsebriggs said:
with a flow jet:thumbsup:
Click to expand...
they all do.. the 5.25, 5.75, 6, 6.25, 7, 8, 10 and 16 horse Horizontal shaft engines ALL USE flowjet carbs, up till like 2000 something, when they switched to the china Walbro carb for a year or two, before switching to Overhead Valve motors..

Beal said:
Thats a neat engine. I like the improvised tinwork there.

I have a 5hp that was this copper color, Id like to restore it to its former copper-esque-ness. Does anyone know what that color is called?
Click to expand...
No.. people have tried figuring it.. They end up taking it in and duplicating it.. There are factory colors that are pretty damned close, but not sure they color code to them..

kawazukimaha said:
Izzy - The robin? Are you talking Gen Set? That's what the ole' guy said.
Click to expand...
could be.. :shrug: Just a Wisconsin Robin.. Whatever ya wanna put it on.. wisconsin is the Builder, Robin is the model... Other companies build them too.
 
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