Yet another welder thread

korndog

korndog

New Member
#1
#1
So after much agonizing, reading, posting, and reading again, I have decided on a ac/dc stick welder. Seems capable of doing everything I need without a steep learning curve. Now to decide on which one. Input welcome as to sources for new and used units and good brands/models.
I will need to do sone hardfacing on aluminum, so how-to appreciated as well. I can maybe still be talked out of this, but you will have to tangle with oldsalt. I have to wire in the power so I'm trying to keep the equipment cost to a minimum of course.

KD
 
gpxsrxracer

gpxsrxracer

New Member
#4
#4
korndog said:
So after much agonizing, reading, posting, and reading again, I have decided on a ac/dc stick welder. Seems capable of doing everything I need without a steep learning curve. Now to decide on which one. Input welcome as to sources for new and used units and good brands/models.
I will need to do sone hardfacing on aluminum, so how-to appreciated as well. I can maybe still be talked out of this, but you will have to tangle with oldsalt. I have to wire in the power so I'm trying to keep the equipment cost to a minimum of course.

KD
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Man, I think your making a big mistake...its WAY harder to stick weld over a mig welder. Plus if you want to weld thin stuff and sheet metal your gonna get pissed off in a hurry and wish you had bought a mig.
 
Oldsalt

Oldsalt

Well-Known Member
#5
#5
I really believe it is absolutely necessary to own an arc welder first. Unless a guy wants to spend the price of a nice 220V. arc welder on just a roll of stainless steel wire for the mig [and another bottle of special gas] he will not be able to weld stainless. Piece of cake with an arc welder. Also cast iron. The only way is with an arc welder and if a guy decides he will never need to weld cast iron he is most likely wrong. Also hardfaceing. With the arc welder you pick up the few rods required. With a mig your screwed...unless a guy wishes to invest in an expensive spool of wire that he will never use. IM 100% HO its very likely a cop out to decide that it is not necessary to learn to arc weld. I'm thinking the same person would probably he happy to never be able to drive a standard shift car because it is rumered that an automatic is easier. The truth is that it is not difficult, if it was I couldn't do it. As for thin stuff: Back when the earth was still cooling and Indy cars has really skinny tires there was NO such thing as a 'home' model mig welder. I personally have welded a lot of auto body metal, butt welds, with a 1/16" arc rod on stock car bodys. So 18 ga. is a piece of cake if a person really wishes to do it. A minibike's frame tubing is not 'thin' so there is no problem there. The bottom line is that a guy will still need an arc welder even if he gets a mig. Already own a good oxy/acet. set up, and a good hand grinder and bench grinder, and a 220V. arc welder and a welding bench, and clamps and a bunch of other tools? I'm thinking you can then take your time to look around for a good mig, but not before then.
 
M

mxwelder

New Member
#6
#6
I'd consider learning how to gas weld first.

I learned how to weld with an oxy-acetylene torch almost 35 years ago.

With an oxy-acetylene set-up, you can not only weld...you can also braze, silver solder, cut steel, heat up rusted parts, etc.

By simply changing tips, you can weld anything from sheet metal to thicker steel.

Guys that build their own homebuilt airplanes prefer oxy-acetylene for the tubular chrome-moly frames.

Get an oxy-acetylene outfit first, then get an electric welder later. Stick takes more skill than MIG.

Most serious welders have a stick machine and a MIG...and usually a TIG welder too...all depends how versatile you want to be. I could probably get by without a MIG, but not without my TIG/stick machine.
 
gpxsrxracer

gpxsrxracer

New Member
#7
#7
Oldsalt said:
I really believe it is absolutely necessary to own an arc welder first. Unless a guy wants to spend the price of a nice 220V. arc welder on just a roll of stainless steel wire for the mig [and another bottle of special gas] he will not be able to weld stainless. Piece of cake with an arc welder. Also cast iron. The only way is with an arc welder and if a guy decides he will never need to weld cast iron he is most likely wrong. Also hardfaceing. With the arc welder you pick up the few rods required. With a mig your screwed...unless a guy wishes to invest in an expensive spool of wire that he will never use. IM 100% HO its very likely a cop out to decide that it is not necessary to learn to arc weld. I'm thinking the same person would probably he happy to never be able to drive a standard shift car because it is rumered that an automatic is easier. The truth is that it is not difficult, if it was I couldn't do it. As for thin stuff: Back when the earth was still cooling and Indy cars has really skinny tires there was NO such thing as a 'home' model mig welder. I personally have welded a lot of auto body metal, butt welds, with a 1/16" arc rod on stock car bodys. So 18 ga. is a piece of cake if a person really wishes to do it. A minibike's frame tubing is not 'thin' so there is no problem there. The bottom line is that a guy will still need an arc welder even if he gets a mig. Already own a good oxy/acet. set up, and a good hand grinder and bench grinder, and a 220V. arc welder and a welding bench, and clamps and a bunch of other tools? I'm thinking you can then take your time to look around for a good mig, but not before then.
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I think your looking way outside the typical guy or homeowner or backyard mechanic who wants a welder thats only going to use it a handfull of times a year. 99% of people in this category are never gonna weld stainless or cast iron. If they do, the once in a blue moon your gonna need to do that, your far better off taking that one piece to a professional welder, give him a 20 dollar bill and/or a six pack/12 pack and your good. I think you may be a good welder with alot of experiance but fact is a person can go from never welding in his or her life, grab a mig, start welding a piece of sheet metal or some 1/4 plate or whatever and do it within a matter of minuits. An amateur cannot just start arc/stick welding within minuits and weld anything from steel plate down to as thin as sheet metal. Not gonna happen. There is alot of good reasons nobody wants stick welders much anymore...you cant hardly give them away.

We use our mig welder at work 95% of the time(im a mechanic for a city and we weld every day as we have ALOT of vehicles and equipment), it does every job we can immagine, then our tig for aluminum and every once in a while for some small steel parts...our big arc/stick welder collects dust. We only use that once in a blue moon when we repair one of our loader buckets as certain steel pieces are a good inch thick or more, otherwise its never used. No reason to use it, mig is much quicker, easier, ect. You wont find any mechanics in that shop that would rather use a arc over the mig.
 
Oldsalt

Oldsalt

Well-Known Member
#8
#8
gpxsrxracer

You're absolutely right. If a person is not interested in learning how to weld as it involves more than a small effort and he does expect a need to weld anything but relatively thin mild steel and he only has use for a welder on a very infrequent basis he should buy a mig.
 
F

flathead_fred

New Member
#10
#10
This guy is absoultly correct!!! I have been working as a fabricator for 25 years. I started welding with gas first, then learned stick and moved on to mig. Once you have learned these fundamentals you will have no problems with Tig... You cant go wrong with a good used Lincoln or Miller machine. Good luck HotRod.
 
Oldsalt

Oldsalt

Well-Known Member
#11
#11
I keep thinking that a guy that does not but very infrequently use a welder should probably use flux core wire.

The big advantage of flux core, but only an advantage for the infrequent user, is that there won't be a gas bottle on the back of the cart which will allow the welder to be pushed up closer to the wall and take up less floor space in the garage where the room is really needed for the wife's excess yard sale purchases, the kids old broken plastic toys, broken bicycles and laundry baskets. Even though I'm not married I know what the 'infrequent hobbyest husband's' garage looks like.
 
korndog

korndog

New Member
#12
#12
Here is a lost of what I plan to do:

All manner of mini bike fabrication, repair and reinforcement.
Some engine welding like lifter bore facing in flatheads, possibly filling heads.
Some stainless schedule 40 square tubing framing
Miscellaneous household repair.

I don't anticipate the need to weld sheet metal. The welder will probably used infrequently unless I find it fun to weld.

Best
KD
 
Neck

Neck

Growing up is optional
#13
#13
Welding?

I will chime in here....I made the mistake (or not) of telling my boss that I wanted to learn how to weld back in the 70s. At the time I didn't understand why he snickered and rubbed his hands together, but it didn't take long to find out. From then on for the next five years, that's pretty much all he would let me do! Working in a rock quarry, there's always a lot of welding to be done, especially one with a dredge! And stick welding was all there was in the yard at the time. 6010, 6011,6012, 7016, 7018, 100018d2, manganese,cast iron, hard facing, gouging, you name it, I burned it, 3/32, 1/8, 5/32, 3/16, 1/4, uphill, overhead, flat, Burn baby burn! Talk about people replant! You strike an arc and nobody comes around you! Stick is an excellent way to learn how to weld! If you can run a nice stringer up hill with Low hydrogen 7018,or Manganese rod, you can weld with anything! When they bought a wire feed, which burned inner-shield, It was almost like cheating! But if your in a hurry to learn, buy a mig. You can become a competent welder much quicker!
 
korndog

korndog

New Member
#14
#14
Neck said:
I will chime in here....I made the mistake (or not) of telling my boss that I wanted to learn how to weld back in the 70s. At the time I didn't understand why he snickered and rubbed his hands together, but it didn't take long to find out. From then on for the next five years, that's pretty much all he would let me do! Working in a rock quarry, there's always a lot of welding to be done, especially one with a dredge! And stick welding was all there was in the yard at the time. 6010, 6011,6012, 7016, 7018, 100018d2, manganese,cast iron, hard facing, gouging, you name it, I burned it, 3/32, 1/8, 5/32, 3/16, 1/4, uphill, overhead, flat, Burn baby burn! Talk about people replant! You strike an arc and nobody comes around you! Stick is an excellent way to learn how to weld! If you can run a nice stringer up hill with Low hydrogen 7018,or Manganese rod, you can weld with anything! When they bought a wire feed, which burned inner-shield, It was almost like cheating! But if your in a hurry to learn, buy a mig. You can become a competent welder much quicker!
Click to expand...
Oh hell Neck, I'll just come to your house. I didn't know you was a welding guru. Lol,,,, :weld:
 
Neck

Neck

Growing up is optional
#15
#15
That's what that 200 amp Miller with the big ass co2 bottle strapped to it sitting in the corner of my garage is for buddy! Turn me loose!!
 
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